ProtoBlade - Add 512KB SRAM & SD to make your prop protoboard a RamBlade/TriBla

Cluso99

OBC (oldbitcollector) asked me about making·an equivalent RamBlade circuit using·the Prop ProtoBoard.

There are a few reasons why this is not really possible, so here is an alternative. It will not run as fast as a RamBlade because I cannot use the same address and data pins as on my RamBlade. The circuit is more like the TriBlade (Blade #2 section) which is what we have been developing ZiCog & CPM on. It is bigger than a RamBlade of course and you have to solder and wire it yourself.

You cannot have anything else wired on the ProtoBoard without potential conflicts. Specifically this means you cannot have the additional resistors fitted for the VGA, Keyboard or mouse.

The only connections possible with this circuit is via the two programming pins P30 & P31. This may be...

• Serial communications using the 2-pins
  • Non-USB ProtoBoard:·optionally via a propplug
  • USB ProtoBoard: via the USB connection (it can be cut and optional links fitted to seperate the PropPlug section)
• OR
  • Keyboard using the 1-pin keyboard circuit
  • Video (TV) composite using the 1-pin video circuit - monochrome (black & white) only

What you require...

• SRAM AS6C4008-55PCN 512KB 55ns DIP32 from Future Electronics
• SD or microSD socket or SD to microSD adapter
• 4 x 10K (optional)
• 2·x 0.1uF mono capacitors
• 1 x 1uF 6V (or > 6V) Tantalum capacitor
• SD or microSD card

I have added 4 x 10K (optional) to the parts list. I had intended to use the existing 4 x 10K pullups (with links) on the PS2 keyboard and mouse connectors. However, I think it would be better to add these resistors seperately and keep the PS2 Keyboard circuit (plus additions) for the 1-pin keyboard circuit. Therefore, I will change the microSD pins DO, CLK, DI from P24, P25, P26 to P0, P1, P2. Updated circuit to be posted soon.

The schematic of the ProtoBlade is attached·

Note the 1-pin video will be connected to P30 and the 1-pin keyboard will be connected to P31, both via links (not as the schematic shows).

If you want to use the·1-pin video and 1-pin keyboard circuits then you will also require...

• 1 x PS2 Socket Digikey CP-4060-ND
• 1 x 270R
• 3 x 10K
• 1 x 15K
• 1 x 1500pF·capacitor (ceramic or greencap)
• option extras 1 x 120R, 1 x 180R, 1 x 470pF
• RCA-RCA·(yellow preferred) video cable - cutoff 1 end
• Optional 2-pin plug and socket for RCA video cable - else solder cable to pcb directly

The schematic of the 1-pin video and keyboard circuits are also attached

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Links to other interesting threads:

· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBlade,·RamBlade,·SixBlade, website
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: CPUs Z80 etc; Micros Altair etc;· Terminals·VT100 etc; (Index) ZiCog (Z80) , MoCog (6809)
· Search the Propeller forums·(uses advanced Google search)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBladeProp is: www.bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm

Post Edited (Cluso99) : 1/6/2010 3:37:06 PM GMT

Toby Seckshund

Surely this one could be crammed into a thimble.

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Style and grace : Nil point

BradC

Toby Seckshund said...
Surely this one could be crammed into a thimble.

Why stop there? I have some Lego coffee mugs around somewhere. Better still, inside the body of a Lego man. It'd make the 6 Million Dollar man look positively technologically bereft.

Can you imagine a network of Lego people all interlinked around a Lego city with hands joined in a ring? Maybe we need to get humaniodo to research this for his next supercomputer! [noparse]:)[/noparse]

If you put some of them on a Lego Thomas, shunted by a Lego fat controller you could have a dynamically reconfiguring network.

<Colonel Voice On>
Stop, stop, stop! This is getting too silly. Now, get on with it!
</>

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Life may be "too short", but it's the longest thing we ever do.

Oldbitcollector (Jeff)

@Ray,

How about increasing the speed of this design by replacing the crystal.
An easy switch out to match the one used in Ramblade.

OBC

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New to the Propeller?

Visit the: The Propeller Pages @ Warranty Void.

Cluso99

OBC:

My comment 'not as fast' is because of the extra instructions required for each sram access due to data/address layout.

I would prefer not to deal with overclocking issues here.

re your layout comment on msn - agreed, no easy way - could do it in software but that would be a severe penalty.

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Links to other interesting threads:

· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBlade,·RamBlade,·SixBlade, website
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: CPUs Z80 etc; Micros Altair etc;· Terminals·VT100 etc; (Index) ZiCog (Z80) , MoCog (6809)
· Search the Propeller forums·(uses advanced Google search)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBladeProp is: www.bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm

Cluso99

See top post for changes (in red)

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Links to other interesting threads:

· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBlade,·RamBlade,·SixBlade, website
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: CPUs Z80 etc; Micros Altair etc;· Terminals·VT100 etc; (Index) ZiCog (Z80) , MoCog (6809)
· Search the Propeller forums·(uses advanced Google search)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBladeProp is: www.bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm

Toby Seckshund

BradC

We have had cigarette packets, then match boxes.... the next cardboard recepticle, for one of my designs, will be the centre of a long strip of perferated paper ( often used within the confines of the bathroom facilities )

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Style and grace : Nil point

Cluso99

It is fine to show a nice tiny board in a matchbox running CPM, but don't look at the size of the power pack LOL

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Links to other interesting threads:

· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBlade,·RamBlade,·SixBlade, website
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: CPUs Z80 etc; Micros Altair etc;· Terminals·VT100 etc; (Index) ZiCog (Z80) , MoCog (6809)
· Search the Propeller forums·(uses advanced Google search)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBladeProp is: www.bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm

Toby Seckshund

That was always the case. The device was the size of a matchbox, the power supply was 2-3 car batteries and the thing had to be dunked in a fast flowing mountain stream to stay cool.

When I were a lad ... the PSU was half of the bay the goddies were another quarter of the bay and the rest was occupied by cooling.

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Style and grace : Nil point

mikediv

Clusso that was really decent of you Thank you very much I had dreamed about doing this since I have a few proto boards and wanted to play with you guys, Thanks again

Cluso99

No problems mike. The more people doing this the quicker we will get a nice OS. I am not in it for the money as long as I can cover my physical costs.

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Links to other interesting threads:

· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBlade,·RamBlade,·SixBlade, website
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: CPUs Z80 etc; Micros Altair etc;· Terminals·VT100 etc; (Index) ZiCog (Z80) , MoCog (6809)
· Search the Propeller forums·(uses advanced Google search)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBladeProp is: www.bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm

Oldbitcollector (Jeff)

@Ray,

Is this design stable now.. [noparse]:)[/noparse] I want to start laying out the Protoboard for it.

OBC

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New to the Propeller?

Visit the: The Propeller Pages @ Warranty Void.

Dr_Acula

Re Toby "When I were a lad ... the PSU was half of the bay the goddies were another quarter of the bay and the rest was occupied by cooling."

When my dad was a lad he says that air conditioning was very expensive at the university and only Computers and Laboratory Rats got air conditioning. But try telling that to the youth of today and they don't believe you...

Cluso, I've sent you the payment for the board just now via paypal.

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www.smarthome.viviti.com/propeller

Toby Seckshund

It goes one way or the other now in eqipment rooms. Either it is like an oven, and they carp on about how unreliable it it, or it's like the cold end of siberia ( then you have to fight your way through everybodies lunch boxes and milk bottles ).

Is the ProtoBlade compatable with the RamBlade software, now you have changed a few details? I can't remember seeing a full cct diag for the RamBlade, just the proof of concept back at the begining.


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Style and grace : Nil point

Post Edited (Toby Seckshund) : 1/6/2010 12:39:36 PM GMT

hinv

Hi,

I don't understand what could be the insurmountable problem with getting the pins you want on the prop on the Protoboard, considering that many people cut down their Protoboards for particular applications, removing some resistors or traces would be no problem really. I, for one, have a stash of protoboards for projects to come because I don't want to be without them when things get bad here shortly, and I have more time on my hands to build(instead of chat and work). Is there something I am missing(like in the private conversation between Cluso99 and OBC) that would prove to be a show stopper from getting the preferable pins for memory?

I also didn't see where you would connect up the 1 pin video and 1pin keyboard would sit considering in the schematic every pin is used unless you wanted to put them on the connector for the proplug after it is booted.

In the parts list, you list 10K 15K 120R and 280R, I am assuming these are resisters at 10Kohm, 15Kohm, 120ohm and 280ohm. Am I correct in this assumption?
I can see how you quickly you went to a 3 chip solution because of the lack of pins. A portB prop would be handy right now also.....I'm only sayin.....

Maybe what is needed is mctrivia or somebody to come up with a tiny little square board to solder to the bottom of a protoboard to provide the memory connection with the Beau high speed serial to the protoboard for memory transfer and boot. If It was done cheaply and not overdone, so a great number of people could afford it, that would be great. I too would like to see a cheap, readily available big memory platform for the prop. So far, what I have seen doesn't fit the bill.

Correction: Now that I have read the RamBlade thread, I can say that I am impressed. It will fit the bill if it is readily available $40 is cheap enough for me.

Doug

Post Edited (hinv) : 1/7/2010 4:06:53 AM GMT

Cluso99

Toby:
No, as I said at the top of this post, it is not the same address/data pins as the RamBlade, so a different driver has to be used. It will be slower because of more instructions per sram access. The RamBlade is optimised for speed and has a chip to disable the eeprom which you cannot do on the ProtoBoard easily. I will do the drivers, so it will run a variant of SphinxOS and ZiCog just like the RamBlade/TriBlade/DracBlade variants. The same applies to anything else I do for the RamBlade/TriBlade/ProtoBlade.

I wanted to keep the ProtoBoard as simple as possible to wire. The ProtoBoard is preset to use P30-31 for the PropPlug or USB versions.

Now I should say, that the RamBlade was primarily designed to be an add-on board to the ProtoBoard, SpinStudio Board, DemoBoard, or pretty much any other board including other non-propeller boards providing a serial connection is available. The same can apply to the ProtoBoard. It can be pluged into another ProtoBoard (or others) via cable, but not piggyback like the RamBlade. The 1-pin video & keyboards are an extra option for SBC operation.

So, I expect the long term of this will be to use a second prop for the many I/O connections. In effect, this becomes the "computer" and the second prop becomes the "super-intelligent peripheral(s)".

OBC:
No changes EXCEPT the circuit for the 1-pin video and 1-pin keyboard shown above is for the RamBlade, not the ProtoBlade. These pins will need to be done by links [noparse][[/noparse]shunts] to P30 & P31 respectively. If you want to position the 1-pin video 270R resistor, one end to a link [noparse][[/noparse]shunt] to P30, the other end to a 2 x 1 0.1" header for the RCA cable to be either plugged in or soldered directly to (a real RCA socket will not fit). Also, the 1-pin keyboard parts utilising the existing keyboard or mouse connector holes and the 2 x 10k pullups. One end of each of the 15K and 1500pF capacitors will solder to the 100R positions at the 10K end and the other not to the P24/25/26/27 end (as these are not the pins we will be using), but to a link [noparse][[/noparse]shunt] to P31; also add the 10K 3V3 pullup. Hope you can follow this.

For the USB ProtoBoard, I suggest you show an option for cutting the P30, P31 & Reset tracks and route these plus Gnd to a 2 x 4 0.1" header so that the USB section may be split to become a seperate PropPlug or linked with 3 shunts.

I will most likely be on msn from 10am (I am GMT+11:00) if you have any questions.

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Links to other interesting threads:

· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBlade,·RamBlade,·SixBlade, website
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: CPUs Z80 etc; Micros Altair etc;· Terminals·VT100 etc; (Index) ZiCog (Z80) , MoCog (6809)
· Search the Propeller forums·(uses advanced Google search)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBladeProp is: www.bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm

Toby Seckshund

Cluso

Did you ever consider Drams, and retain some spare pins (like DracBlade), or was the quest for speed the sole driving force? I only ask because the datasheets I have been nosing at lead me to think that they are sub-systems in their own right. Perhaps the simplisity of statics has got the edge

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Style and grace : Nil point

Cluso99

Toby: Yes, statics are much simpler which actually translates to faster. I went for pure speed and simplicity after seeing the TriBlade useage.

As I have stated many times, I prefer using a second prop for the intelligent I/O. It only requires 2 pins to communicate with the RamBlade, ProtoBlade or DracBlade. Then you have all the standard obex drivers able to work on the second prop.

You do not need a handful of latches, even though they are cheap - just an $8 prop chip (more expensive but IMHO outways the complexities of pcb design and software).

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Links to other interesting threads:

· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBlade,·RamBlade,·SixBlade, website
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: CPUs Z80 etc; Micros Altair etc;· Terminals·VT100 etc; (Index) ZiCog (Z80) , MoCog (6809)
· Search the Propeller forums·(uses advanced Google search)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBladeProp is: www.bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm

Toby Seckshund

Yes you are right that to use the Props as·a Building blocks will always look more elegant. Big flashy chips look purposeful but glue logic looks retro/cludged, even though it uses less gates overall.

That was the interest in the DRAMs, same chip count but more pins available. I like the simlicity of ProtoBlade but want the VGA of DracBlabe as the 625 line monitors are all glass, and so bigger, and the resolution sucks for 80 columns. I also have a draw full of logic chips, but not of Props.

You just don't get scrap units to scrounge the beasties out of, Hey-Ho.

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Style and grace : Nil point

Mike Huselton

You said...
OBC (oldbitcollector) asked me about making an equivalent RamBlade circuit using the Prop ProtoBoard.

There are a few reasons why this is not really possible...

Can you clarify?

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JMH

Cluso99

Mike: I explained why in that post (the top one). The ProtoBlade is similar but not the same.

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Links to other interesting threads:

· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBlade,·RamBlade,·SixBlade, website
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: CPUs Z80 etc; Micros Altair etc;· Terminals·VT100 etc; (Index) ZiCog (Z80) , MoCog (6809)
· Search the Propeller forums·(uses advanced Google search)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBladeProp is: www.bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm

Cluso99

JMH: Sorry if I was short. I was just on the way out.

I took the RamBlade to the 'n'th degree for speed. Therefore there are a few issues that are just not worth repeating in a ProtoBoard design where it is likely to have other uses as well. Particularly, the serial pins are connected either to an external propplug or to an onboard USB propplug equivalent. These would have to be rewired.

It is intended that the drivers should hide these aspects.

I am curious to know how many are interested to build this version?

Would a pcb be worthwhile (for smt RAM & microSD socket) ?

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Links to other interesting threads:

· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBlade,·RamBlade,·SixBlade, website
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: CPUs Z80 etc; Micros Altair etc;· Terminals·VT100 etc; (Index) ZiCog (Z80) , MoCog (6809)
· Search the Propeller forums·(uses advanced Google search)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBladeProp is: www.bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm

Oldbitcollector (Jeff)

Cluso99 said...

I am curious to know how many are interested to build this version?

I'm partway into one here.. "Life" issues keep getting in the way this week. [noparse]:)[/noparse]

OBC

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New to the Propeller?

Visit the: The Propeller Pages @ Warranty Void.