How many Propeller Sytem Module Users are there?
blittled
Posts: 681
I picked up a PSM at the UPE NE this weekend and was wondering how many people have them. Ray did an excellent job with it. I originally was going to add it to my, as OBC said, "fully loaded" Boe-Bot but I'll have too much fun with it as is. I'm getting some rather ambitious ideas for it and was wondering if others would be interested. Some ideas are:
Conversions of some of the video drivers such as AIGeneric.
Interfacing it with Visual Studio Net in serial mode.
A maze game where you tilt to control a "marble" as it goes through while avoiding falling into holes.
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What electronics need - MORE POWER!!!!!!!
Conversions of some of the video drivers such as AIGeneric.
Interfacing it with Visual Studio Net in serial mode.
A maze game where you tilt to control a "marble" as it goes through while avoiding falling into holes.
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What electronics need - MORE POWER!!!!!!!
Comments
As I understand it, now there are two different versions? Maybe Rayman will expand on this.
I was fortunate enough to get the battery back system to attach to my PSM.
I agree, a conversion of the AIgeneric driver with character redefinition would be awesome!
Added: Started a better look at AIgeneric tonight. An adaption might not be a difficult as I thought.
OBC
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New to the Propeller?
Visit the: The Propeller Pages @ Warranty Void.
Post Edited (Oldbitcollector) : 8/24/2009 3:19:07 AM GMT
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My Prop Info&Apps: ·http://www.rayslogic.com/propeller/propeller.htm
I have 0034 and yes Rayman I am also a happy PSM owner.
Ray, I did not find the description/part number of the 60 pin LCD display.
Where did you hide it?
Clever Signature Goes Here
This is my first post-reply·on this forum,·and, prior to commenting on·topic, I'd just like to say that this wonderful forum here of Propeller users and related support from Parallax is a big part of the reason why I chose the Propeller and had confidence that I could come up to speed with it.· I've read through hundreds of posts (easily a 1000+) on a myriad of topics, and I just have to say that you folks are incredible in terms of your helpfulness, enthusiasm and respectful demeanor·(particularly to new-comers).· I really appreciate the·effort that·so many of you have put into this forum, often above-and-beyond the call of duty, so to speak, making the world a better place in your own not-necessarily-little way.· Many thanks!
I'm new to the Propeller and to embedded (but not to programming or general electronics), and I'm using my PSM to cut my teeth on learning Propeller programming (and hardware). I was fortunate enough·to selfishly snag the last PSM of the first batch at the promotional price (thanks Nick for holding it for me while I worked out my Pay-Pal problem and for arranging shipping to Taiwan), but I definitely think the device is worth the regular price and would have purchased it at that price had I missed the promotion.· In part, I just think it's cool to have such a display, but·the display aspect is·also related to a project/interest.· In addition, I can see where, for example, the PSM would allow someone working from a laptop to program and test in the field/on-the-go without lugging a monitor around.· If there are laptops that have video inputs (whether composite or RGB-In (not Out)), then perhaps the on-board display wouldn't be needed (anyone care to comment?), but once the EEPROM is burned, it's still nice to have a self-contained compact device WITH a display.· Anyway,·the PSM is·another way to go in terms of·board options, and, generally speaking, the more, the better.· Of course, the nature of the Propeller lends itself to one being able to design·his or her·own boards, but it's nice to hit the ground running with a pre-built board for those like me anxious to start learning Propeller coding.
I realize that the Propeller is ideally suited for TV and RGB displays (those are kind of native capabilities when combined with the associated·S/W objects), but I like being able to use·the Propeller·with a small LCD module (without having to go through a relatively expensive and bulky converter board).· And, although·I realize that the Propeller is partly targeted at the robotics world where an on-board display is not necessarily required,·such a display·might be useful in some cases.· But, outside of robotics, I think there are plenty of applications where the Propeller might be applicable which might benefit or require an LCD display, and·I have some non-robotics ideas in mind that do require such a display.· In my opinion, the ARM-based BeagleBoard system arguably errored in not breaking out LCD signals in its first couple incarnations, considering its likely applicability to portable devices.· Well, the Propeller does not integrate a built-in LCD controller, per se, and it was obviously expertly designed to excel at·a narrower range of applications,·but·you can't blame us Propeller-heads for identifying needs and ways to stretch the Propeller beyond its original design goals, and everyone here on this forum is very supportive of that providing that the Propeller is reasonably applicable. ·
As such, I'd like to see more discussion on this forum about connecting the Propeller and also the Propeller II (if and when·that materializes) to small LCDs using, for example, 8-bit pixel-data connections plus h-sync, v-sych, dot-clock (if required) and so on, whether it be with an LCD with built-in GRAM that can be written to more leisurely like on Ray's PSM, or to an LCD requiring 60 FPS data refreshing.·
Although I'm learning PASM and timing-related stuff, I still haven't definitively concluded whether or not·the Propeller·has the muscle (and lack of·a memory bottleneck) to drive·the latter (al beit with only a few colors due to limited memory).· It's at least pushing the limits, I expect, especially in one cog, but, even if the first incarnation of the Propeller can't manage it or manage it flexibly enough,·I'm hopeful that I can gain some valuable experience with the Propeller that might help me work with the Propeller II, which is rumored to have more horsepower, shared memory and faster memory throughput.· I know Ray has another thread running·about the "new" display he's working with and has succeeded in filling the screen with color, but I don't think he's definitively stated whether that display has built-in graphics RAM, though I'd kind of be surprised if it did (yeah, I should comment there, but please· pardon my detour).
Anyway, I think we could use a separate thread just devoted to interfacing small LCD displays that would talk about the possibilities, limitations and challenges involved, or shed more light on the applicability of the Propeller II to such displays.· I'm just wondering if others might be interested in this topic, and, if so, perhaps we can spin it off this thread to live on its own as a convenient·repository for all things LCD/Propeller-related.
But back to the question at hand, yes, count me among the ranks of satisfied PSM owner-operators trucking the Propeller through its paces, and thanks for asking (I'd been meaning to comment).· The board module is nicely designed and I haven't had any problems with it.· There might be some uncertainty in·a new user's mind in terms of how its usage·might differ from its composite/RGB brethern·in terms of the software objects that are out there·(I'm still a bit uncertain myself, as I've been happy enough just being able to write/run SPIN and PASM test programs with convenient output), but Ray seems to have done a good job of converting/customizing the most-common display-related objects (or otherwise writing related code), and I'm assuming that non-display-related objects should work without change.· Being able to get an embedded learning system (at least in terms of my particular usage so far) with a display for anywhere near a Benjamin is a blessing when one compares it to what Freescale (etc.) charge for theirs, and even the admittedly more powerful (but differently-targeted) ARM-based BeagleBoard or Gumstix offerings don't come with a display, and, more·significantly,·appear to be·a LOT more daunting in terms of programming (ARM assembly/C/Linux, though they·have an active user-community, as well) and hardware·prototyping.· So, "Hats Off!" to Ray and Nick for designing the PSM and making it available, respectively, as well as to the fine·crew at Parallax for all of their efforts and support.
Wow.. Welcome to the Propeller! (And the PSM for that matter) Good to have you aboard!
OBC
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New to the Propeller?
Visit the: The Propeller Pages @ Warranty Void.
So, it's just a matter of time before I can offer a "Propeller System Board (PSB)" with this LCD.
Also, since I believe I can get vast quantities of these displays at low cost, I intend the sell the bare LCD (w/touchscreen) and provide detailed info on how to hook it up...
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My Prop Info&Apps: ·http://www.rayslogic.com/propeller/propeller.htm
And to Ray, my pleasure, but thanks again to you for developing the convenient PSM system. It's the perfect little dev. system for my particular needs (and then some).
But regarding your progress with the 4.3" display, so you are driving the display directly in real time without the display having built in GRAM like the ILI9325 controller of the PSM display. That's great!
In thinking about this a little bit, I can see where it would be easier to "sweep" the display in a (likely fixed/solid) color from a cog register than it would be to read in the data from a display buffer in shared memory. But, apparently, you're hopeful to move the bits around fast enough to be able to drive the display.
Or am I reading that wrong? Maybe you're planning on generating, for example, text on-the-fly instead of reading graphics/text from a display buffer. If doing the latter, I realize that there's only enough memory to support maybe 4 colors per pixel (depending on the display resolution) without resorting to "tricks."
By the way, I'm assuming that your driving the display using the so-called serial-RGB technique (as with the PSM), wherein only one color (R, G, or
Anyway, I'm interested in your work/projects, and I look forward to hearing more details about the above-mentioned display and the driving and interfacing details, as well as product offerings.
Thanks,
Jim
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My Prop Info&Apps: ·http://www.rayslogic.com/propeller/propeller.htm
In that I'm using your PSM system, I've only looked into how the VGA driving system/code works a little bit since the PSM drives an LCD display in a different way.
Anyway, by 6-bit color, I'm guessing you mean (2^2)*(2^2)*(2^2) = 2^6 = 64 possible total colors, or 2 bits = 4 shades each of red, green and blue, even if the Prop doesn't necessarily generate/use all those colors at once. That is, you're not talking about 6 bits of red, 6 bits of green and 6 bits of blue = 2^18 colors, right? Right.
So, in testing, you succeeding in lowering the refresh rate down to 14 Hz. Well that's interesting. Yeah, we're not doing video here, and likely not doing animation, although 14 Hz would be adequate for some animation. My needs, for example, are mostly confined to static displays; however, I would like to be able to change the background color of the display pretty much "instantaneously" without seeing those diagonal tearing lines that happen when the data is not sent out quickly enough. Anyway, I've read that the charge-pump capacitors (or whatever they're called) behind the transistors in active matrix (TFT) screens need to be refreshed fairly quickly or the pixels will start fading. So, I'm wondering if you noticed anything in the way of flicker going down so low. If not, that refresh rate is perfect for my needs and that of many of us, I think.
I'm also curious about whether you're talking about doing this (or have done this) is one cog. I know that another thread mentioned generating video using 3 synchronized cogs, which is a cool solution if that's what it takes; however, for my particular project, that would cause me to run out of cogs. Anyway, it's still a very interesting solution, and, I'm guessing, if that is feasible, then if-and-when the Prop II comes out (with 8 times the speed, etc), such display driving could probably be done in 1 cog.
So, you say that you plan to modify the std. VGA driver to output the dot clock and so on, but don't you also need to do that now, even for color bars? Or are you using some internal circuitry in the display (like test circuitry) to generate them. I mean, if you're sending out the pixel data in your rudimentary testing, wouldn't you also be obliged to generate h-sync, v-synch and the dot clock? I'm a little confused there in terms of what you've already done, but I understand from what you've said the direction in which you're heading. Anyway, I know that others have mentioned that the data sheet doesn't specify a minimum dot clock frequency, but maybe that just means that the lower one goes, the more flickering one will notice (though hopefully no cumulative damage to the display). Anyway, it sounds like a forgiving display, timing-wise (although I haven't looked into it front/back porch timing requirements and so on).
Hmm, and lastly, VGA and LCD output signals "using the same pins": okay...because you're planning to use the LCD display like a VGA monitor. But would one be able to simultaneoulsy connect both kinds of devices and drive them both at the same time using the same program? Well, I guess the VGA signals would need to go through a resistor network (pseudo D/A converter) to generate the different voltage levels. But could, for example, the signals go directly to an LCD display and also T-off to the resistors and on to a VGA monitor? Or would some buffering (or similar) be needed? Anyway, you're probably not going to require people to disconnect the LCD from the connector just to connect to a VGA monitor, but I just wonder what would happen if one tried to use both at the same time (in terms of source current, signal reflections and so on). It's not actually important for my project, but I'm just curious as I try to come up to speed with this LCD/VGA interfacing. But you seem like not only a theoretical person, but also a hands-on person that will just try it and see. That is, it seems like you're the kind that would say, "Well, they told me it would never work from a theoretical standpoint, but I wired it up and "voil
I'll post code and schematics soon in the other thread, so you can see all the details...
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My Prop Info&Apps: ·http://www.rayslogic.com/propeller/propeller.htm
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What electronics need - MORE POWER!!!!!!!
▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
My Prop Info&Apps: ·http://www.rayslogic.com/propeller/propeller.htm