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Look for schematic of simple SX chip programmer — Parallax Forums

Look for schematic of simple SX chip programmer

ValioValio Posts: 29
edited 2009-05-28 22:06 in General Discussion
Please share schematic of simple programmer for SX28


Previously I use PonyProg, but unfortunately it doesn't support SX architecture, so if possible,
I want to build simple programmer, that doesn't require another processor inside like Fluff offer.

I seen simple drawing of SX-TIPS and a lot of mentions about Parallax free programmer offer,
unfortunatelly they removed all links to that and any info.


regards,
Alex

Comments

  • BeanBean Posts: 8,129
    edited 2009-05-12 21:55
    Alex,
    I don't think a PC could generate the timing that is required. That is why all the programmers have a microcontroller on them.

    Fluffy and Fluffy2 are the only other programmers that I am aware of.

    Here is the document that shows the timing to program the SX. Maybe you can build something yourself http://www.parallax.com/Portals/0/Downloads/docs/prod/sx/DeviceProgramming.pdf

    The SX-Blitz is the parallax programmer. It has a USB interface and is only $30. It sure would save you alot of work. http://www.parallax.com/StoreSearchResults/tabid/768/txtSearch/blitz/List/0/SortField/4/ProductID/368/Default.aspx

    Bean.

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    There is a fine line between arrogance and confidence. Make sure you don't cross it...



    Post Edited (Bean (Hitt Consulting)) : 5/12/2009 10:00:38 PM GMT
  • ValioValio Posts: 29
    edited 2009-05-12 22:13
    Hi Bean!

    Thanks a lot for your kind explanation.

    I heard that SX-Key of SX-TIPS feeds from COM port and have discrete element design, but maybe im wrong.
    Anyway look plz here: minsk555.narod.ru/jdm.htm
    or here : www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Station/7733/

    Besides Ubicom prev. offer simple programmer: www.ubicom.com/techdocs/appnotes/index.html (link removed)
    here some pictures: www.electrosnab.ru/ubicom/Ubicom_4.htm
  • BeanBean Posts: 8,129
    edited 2009-05-12 22:29
    Alex,
    The original SX-Key did use a COM port. But it still had an SX onboard. All of the Parallax SX programmers have an SX onboard.

    The USB SX-Key uses the FTDI chip as a USB to Serial interface. So it is still serial even though it uses a USB port.

    Bean.

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    There is a fine line between arrogance and confidence. Make sure you don't cross it...

    ·
  • ValioValio Posts: 29
    edited 2009-05-12 22:45
    Thank Bean, sorry for my insistence.

    Can you advice, if I can use this quartz HCMOS/TTL generators:
    www.chipdip.ru/library/DOC000053903.pdf
    I can buy it locally. they have 50, 60, 80 MHz
    Or I have to use exactly Parallax 75 MHz TTL Oscillator ?

    Should I pay for inside US delivery (Boston) if order from site ?

    Thanks a lot.


    PS: Plz, send me links for Fluffy and Fluffy2 schematics diagram.
  • BeanBean Posts: 8,129
    edited 2009-05-12 22:53
    That clock should work. It doesn't have to be 75MHz. There are several SX designs that use 80MHz (like the XGS Pico).

    If you can have it delivered to Boston and have someone forward it you that would be alot cheaper I suspect.

    Just google for "Fluffy programmer" for schematics.

    Bean.

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    There is a fine line between arrogance and confidence. Make sure you don't cross it...

    ·
  • ValioValio Posts: 29
    edited 2009-05-12 23:05
    Sure I found it:

    Fluffy1: www.semis.demon.co.uk/Sx/fluffy/SXmain.htm
    Fluffy2: www.semis.demon.co.uk/Sx/SXmain.htm
    www.codepuppies.com/~ben/sens/pic/sx/

    What is the limitation between v1 and v2 ?

    PS: i have a man in Boston that could agree to pick it up to deliver to my country.
    So, advice - how much deliver inside US ?

    Post Edited (Valio) : 5/12/2009 11:13:07 PM GMT
  • T'SaavikT'Saavik Posts: 60
    edited 2009-05-13 14:55
    As someone who owns a fluffy programmer (and a bunch of smd SX chips mounted to circuit boards) I would encourage you towards the sx key. The in circuit debugging will save your sanity. I tried to tough it out with the emulator, and it is VERY nice, but the in circuit debugging can't be beat and is worth a lot more then $30. I went hog wild and got the PDB, and i have no regrets.

    I still use my fluffy to program these little sx28's on circuit boards, but i do all my testing with the sx key and a dip sx28, and it is wonderful.

    Here is my page with info on my fluffy, its mostly for myself, but maybe you will find it of use:
    www.hellspark.com/dm/ebench/sx/howto.html
  • BeanBean Posts: 8,129
    edited 2009-05-13 16:20
    Alex,
    Just a note: The SX-Blitz does NOT do debugging. You need the SX-Key to do debugging.

    Bean.

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    There is a fine line between arrogance and confidence. Make sure you don't cross it...

    ·
  • RobotWorkshopRobotWorkshop Posts: 2,307
    edited 2009-05-13 17:24
    It looks like the Fluffy programmers would be closer in features to the SX-Blitz if you mainly are looking at a method for programming the chips. For $30 the SX-Blitz is a good value and you keep the 4-pin header that has become the standard for programming these chips. If you plan on programming quite a few of the SX28 chips one thing you can do is get one of the SX28 protoboards, remove the SX28, and install a ZIF socket. It has the 4-pin header on board. That is what I use for those and it works well.

    Robert
  • ValioValio Posts: 29
    edited 2009-05-17 13:43
    Ok gentlemen, thanks for explanations )

    Now I have some questions:
    1) Maybe someone advice me the schematics of SX-Key - cuz page on Parallax with that info was deleted: http://www.parallaxinc.com/html_files/sxtech/sxtech_home.htm and prev. (as I can see on web) this schematic was free for download and repeat for self-made.

    2) If I buy SX-Blitz or SX-Key, what other types of microcontrolles I can program ? Propeller maybe ??

    3) I looked on sxlist schematic of LCD + 4x4 keyboard and cant find it attached on the same unit, but on separate scheme they unfortunately share the same ping of SX28. In general I need 2 row LCD + 4x4 keyb + 1..2 ping as output. Could you plz refer for similar project ?


    PS: plz forward 2 sales - Can I place order for UPS/DeutchePost delivery around the world ?? How much it costs.
  • Mike GreenMike Green Posts: 23,101
    edited 2009-05-17 15:04
    1) I don't believe the schematics of the SX-Key are available

    2) Only the SX. Both the SX-Blitz and the SX-Key are specific for the SX processor.

    3) Not clear what you want. What schematic? Most of these smaller LCDs use the same controller chip, particularly the 1 and 2 line displays. It should be just a matter of using a 2 line display with the same controller (HD????).

    E-mail sales (<sales@parallax.com>) with the details of your questions.
  • ValioValio Posts: 29
    edited 2009-05-17 15:57
    I want to build smth like signal-generator. I need 4x4 keyboard, 2-rows LCD and could pins free for signal output.
    In the sxlist I found subprogram and code modules for LCD and k/b connection, unfortunately their schematic uses
    crosses in use of the same pins, so its impossible to use those modules both as. My question is - maybe someone
    could share (code+scheme) project that help me develop my device.

    Thanks.

    PS: What a programmer uses Propeller, the same as SX ?
  • Steph LindsaySteph Lindsay Posts: 767
    edited 2009-05-18 16:16
    Regarding the Propeller chip:

    The SX-Blitz and SX-Key are not used to program the Propeller chip.

    The Propeller chip may be programmed with a direct serial connection, however it is usually done with the Propeller Plug, which provides a USB/Serial interface with the FTDI chip.· See the Propeller Datasheet for schematics of both.

    If you would like to look for a Parallax distributor in your country, see this page.
  • ValioValio Posts: 29
    edited 2009-05-24 17:47
    I am a great fun of SX proc. series now ))

    Now I am sure that the main marketing mistake and problem was the lack
    of a simple COM circuit programmer in compare with success of PIC and AVR.

    This sad fact stopped million enthusiasts of use in their develop work,
    as I discover while browsing information regarding SX apps.


    PS: Also plz advice where I can get code for "Serial LCD" from page:
    www.parallax.com/ProductInfo/Microcontrollers/ExamplesandApplications/tabid/405/Default.aspx

    Also what a program I should use to get LST for SXSim ? (Sorry for dumb questions)
    I got SX-Key/Blitz Development System Manual 2.0, plz give me a ref. where I can get SXKey20 ?

    Thanks A lot.
  • PJMontyPJMonty Posts: 983
    edited 2009-05-24 18:01
    Valio,

    The SX-Key (and later the SX-BLitz) are the simple COM programmer you are talking about.

    SX-Sim is built into the IDE. When you are developing code and want to run it through SX-Sim, all you have to do is press the button on the right of the toolbar that says "SXSim" (a bit hard to read I'll admit) or acess it via the menu at Run->Launch SX-Sim. The IDE automatically creates the LST file and launches SX-Sim with the LST file.

    Thanks,
    PeterM
  • ValioValio Posts: 29
    edited 2009-05-24 19:42
    Can you share developing IDE plz ? Do you mean SX-KEY soft ?
    But I cant find SX-Key v2.0 software to begin write program for simulator.
  • PJMontyPJMonty Posts: 983
    edited 2009-05-25 17:36
    Valio,

    www.parallax.com/tabid/460/Default.aspx

    Thanks,
    PeterM
  • ValioValio Posts: 29
    edited 2009-05-28 22:06
    Thanks PJMonty and all other !

    Im very happy to join such friendly community, and hope will do my contribution.

    Alex.
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