Tiny webserver
BradC
Posts: 2,601
They are trumpeting the PIC 24F here.
http://hackaday.com/2008/09/18/web-server-on-a-business-card-part-1/
http://hackaday.com/2008/09/25/web-server-on-a-business-card-part-2/
The prop can do all that, faster and can be completely programmed from a serial port with no custom hardware.
Surely there is a marketing opportunity here for the TCP enabled to promote the chip!
.. although the Prop does require one more IC as the PIC has onboard flash..
Anyone have a small SD/TCP board fabbed?
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Pull my finger!
http://hackaday.com/2008/09/18/web-server-on-a-business-card-part-1/
http://hackaday.com/2008/09/25/web-server-on-a-business-card-part-2/
The prop can do all that, faster and can be completely programmed from a serial port with no custom hardware.
Surely there is a marketing opportunity here for the TCP enabled to promote the chip!
.. although the Prop does require one more IC as the PIC has onboard flash..
Anyone have a small SD/TCP board fabbed?
▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
Pull my finger!
Comments
The Ethernet chip is also required.
I bet it could be done with a single chip PIC18F97J60 though.
Ron
Leon
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Amateur radio callsign: G1HSM
Suzuki SV1000S motorcycle
Post Edited (Leon) : 9/29/2008 12:12:49 PM GMT
I've written a spin tcp/ip stack + web server for the prop. It requires an enc28j60 + magnetics which only adds $10 in parts to your project.
Webserver running on a prop: shark.fwdweb.com:88/
Project page: proptcp.googlecode.com/ and harrisonpham.com/embedded/PropTCP/beta/
Attached is a picture of a 2"x2" board I made to mess around with the stack.
Post Edited (Harrison.) : 9/29/2008 4:54:56 PM GMT
It was actually your hardware and stack I was referring to.. it's been done, you did it. I just needs some funky publicity [noparse]:)[/noparse]
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Pull my finger!
1. your original statement " although the Prop does require one more IC as the PIC has onboard flash.." was not true
2. you prefer to use a propeller which is more expensive than the PIC24 used in the hackady project ( both use the ENC28j60 )
3. that you still feel that a PIC18F97J60 which has the processor, memory AND Ethernet hardware is not the better solution
(even though it would be cheaper)
I was told 40 years ago by my University professor, that the definition of an Engineer was " someone who could do for 50cents, what any fool could do for a $"
dont get me wrong, I am not calling you a fool, just pointing out that the best solution is the one which is most appropriate, and cost effective
there seems to be religious fanaticism about the prop which as in all fanaticism, is ill founded
Mike
The Prop is great! for what it was meant to do. A chip that is a jack of all trades is a master of none. I believe in it's balanced capacity, ie. a given set of tasks (yeah I'm going to throw video output in there too), the prop has the edge, and can perform these tasks simultaniously!!!!
Let's see your one-chip-web-server-super-PIC act as a remote terminal for a user!!
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E3 = Thought
http://folding.stanford.edu/·- Donating some CPU/GPU downtime just might lead to a cure for cancer! My team stats.
Harrison, that's a fine looking board. Too bad we can't crack the SDIO WiFi cards for cheap wireless network connections. As always though I'm sure one would run into code-space constraints.
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BUT, don't overrate the power of the Propeller.
Compared with the PIC24 the Propeller has no chance in most applications !
A PIC24H... can execute programs up to 256kByte from his internal Flash with 40 MIPS. Try this with a Propeller.
PIC24 prices ranges from 2$ to 6$, they have a lot of integrated peripherals, like 12 Bit ADC(!), or 10Bit ADC with 1.1MS, SPI, UART, PWM, USB(!)...
How many MIPS has a Propeller?
with Spin ~ 0.5 MIPS
with LMM ~ 5 MIPS
with native PASM (max 496 Instructions) 20 MIPS
That is only for 1 COG, but as you all know, you need a lot of cogs for peripheral functions, and small ASM drivers. So the main application runs also on the propeller only in 1 Cog (mostly Spin).
If you take also the price in account, then there are very few application, where a propeller is the best fitting device.
Especially for commercial use.
Andy
Speaking as someone who has tried just about every embedded webserver going I think the above should read "... The prop could do all of that, ..."
The fact is that at the moment the Microchip offering is attractive as it offers a very complete stack with just about every protocol you could need for free. The data rate is fine for all small embedded applications and it's relatively easy to extend. At the moment there is no stack for the Prop which comes anywhere near those features. I'm just about to sit down and design a commercial product which will use a Prop to do what I think it's going to do best and a PIC to handle the web server. For me it's about using the 'right' tools for the job and if I can save many weeks of work by using something that's already out there then that works for me.
For someone who has enough microprocessor knowledge to be dangerous, the Propeller brings
these abilities within my grasp. So I guess I'm the "any fool" who can do with it $. <smirk>
OBC
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Post Edited (Oldbitcollector) : 10/2/2008 2:54:28 AM GMT
OBC...
I'm not sure there is an argument here. Everyone is actually correct, but coming at it from a slightly different perspective and with slightly different goals.
To me adding a PIC to a Prop makes perfect sense, if that is what gets the product out the door. And then... when someone does the dirty work and gets the whole thing working at a low cost on the Prop (in a way attracts a lot of attention and is simple to hack), you can drop the PIC.
In a recent thread about adding a CPLD to a Prop, I suggested adding an FPGA to a Prop... for much the same reasons. Not that you couldn't design a multi-prop system to do everything that you want it to do, but taking the shortest path has its virtues.
cameras, memory, internet connections... it is a natural progression, but getting there is not so simple.
Use what works now... get rid of the clutter later.
Rich
Good engineering is like magic...
With the Prop, everyone sees the trick... but who cares? It is still magic.