wth is Vex?
o.k. so i went to radio shack this weekend to pick up some Smile for the bots and after the typical 20 minute sales molesting I typically receive, the guy (salesman) finds out I'm building bots.· He then shifts his sales gear into a seriously low gear ratio and starts sputtering about Vex robotics new starter kit that they're going to be putting out next month.· And I'm standing there looking up at a BoeBot kit on the shelf already and thinking?· Why do you need another starter kit, when you're sitting on top of one already?
So the guy tells me the whole spiel about the thing (including the $300 price tag, which almost made me soil myself) and so i'm trying to break the corporate sales loop that he's caught in, long enough to tell him that I'm not really into "starter kits" anymore and that $300 is a bit steep for something that is supposed to be introductory and competing with Parallax's BoeBot; an already established product.· But his retail mind couldn't get around the concept that I wasnt interested and that I REALLY didn't want to pre-order one.· geez.· I hate going into radio shack for that very reason.· I just wanna buy my resistors, caps and wire and go the hell home.· No, I dont need batteries and I'm good on cell phone service.· I think we shoulda just sent Radio shack employees to Iraq.· They wouldnt have to even carry guns.· Just batteries and a 6% commission.· But I know that Parallax does business with R.S. and so the opinions expressed in this post are my own and Parallax is in no way associated nor responsible for my rambling.
Now the point I was getting to, who is Vex robotics?· And will Parallax be pulling the kits out of Radio Shack now?
Just curious...
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daniel woolston
Teksystems Inc.
www.danwoolston.com
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So the guy tells me the whole spiel about the thing (including the $300 price tag, which almost made me soil myself) and so i'm trying to break the corporate sales loop that he's caught in, long enough to tell him that I'm not really into "starter kits" anymore and that $300 is a bit steep for something that is supposed to be introductory and competing with Parallax's BoeBot; an already established product.· But his retail mind couldn't get around the concept that I wasnt interested and that I REALLY didn't want to pre-order one.· geez.· I hate going into radio shack for that very reason.· I just wanna buy my resistors, caps and wire and go the hell home.· No, I dont need batteries and I'm good on cell phone service.· I think we shoulda just sent Radio shack employees to Iraq.· They wouldnt have to even carry guns.· Just batteries and a 6% commission.· But I know that Parallax does business with R.S. and so the opinions expressed in this post are my own and Parallax is in no way associated nor responsible for my rambling.
Now the point I was getting to, who is Vex robotics?· And will Parallax be pulling the kits out of Radio Shack now?
Just curious...
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daniel woolston
Teksystems Inc.
www.danwoolston.com
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Comments
Bishop: I never experience any problems with RS staff, though the first thing I do is head to the component section. It is my experience if you loiter near the front of the store, the staff sees you as a mark, but if you bee-line to a section they tend to leave you alone beyond the "Is there anything I can help you find" question (I typically respond with a question they absolutely cannot answer and they flee after mumbling thier lack of a answer). They figure you know exactly what you want and thier time is better spent on someone who looks clueless. You can then circle back to the other things you were originally interested in and they will show deference to you because your someone in the "know". They are almost always someone with no college experience or an AA at the most, and don't know much beyond thier sales training and personal consumer electronics experienece.
and the vexrobotics.com is so generic. the only thing they have is a cheesy frontpage and some vague data. I noticed that they're 'affiliated' with the First competition. Not sure what thats going to do for them, cause I still come back to the $300 price tag.
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daniel woolston
Teksystems Inc.
www.danwoolston.com
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In Belgium, we had a lot of RS shops, in fact too much, and it was impossible for hem to make enough money for living.
Now, they shut everithing and I have to drive 30Km to buy a resistor.
Regards
However, since there is no source for the 'VEX' starter system, it looks like this is one of those "hit-and-run" competitions, where you can't prepare before the competition. That can't be right, actually, so I'll try to find more.
The description for "VEX" seems to match the description for LEGO Mindstorms, by the way, except VEX has an additional motor. And Mindstorms costs $200 instead of $300. Not that the two systems have anything in common, that we can tell at this point.
Radio Shack is a sponsor, so I assume your salesman was jumping the gun a little, having just been given an over-view presentation of what Radio Shack will be trying to sell. Unfortunately he didn't get the message that it's not in the stores yet. I agree with you it's annoying when people try to sell you something they don't actually have yet. "Vaporware" that used to be called.
However, it's nice to see all of this at the very beginning, so to speak.
i think it'll be the same deal that the tandy computers were...they'll get them in, get all excited about it and then nobody will buy them.
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daniel woolston
Teksystems Inc.
www.danwoolston.com
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Of course, these are designed for college students. Now, the VEX robots (which I still haven't seen) seem designed for junior and senior high use. And there IS a "First Lego League" (FLL) which uses Mindstorms.
I would think Parallax could give Mindstorms a run for the money. The BOEBot is slightly cheaper, certainly MUCH more of a 'robot' (Mindstorms are all LEGO block based. Neat, but plastic LEGO blocks don't scale up very well.· Oh, and the 'Brick' processor only has 3 sensor inputs, and 3 motor outputs), has more sensors, and more I/O.
So, the 'VEX' robots are being "tried-out" by the FIRST competition to fill a niche between the Lego bots and the full FIRST bots. Neat idea, we'll soon see what comes of it.
Post Edited (allanlane5) : 3/21/2005 7:46:09 PM GMT
wait till you see this piece of Smile that radio shack is rolling out:
these are images of the 'vex' system:
http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,1759,1777981,00.asp
for $300?
wow.
good luck with that.
i love how the battery is secured with a bread tie.
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daniel woolston
Teksystems Inc.
www.danwoolston.com
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Its sad to see Dean Kamen still has a "build it and they will buy it" mentality. You'd think after loosing so much money on the Segway, he would have learned (When's the last time you saw someone on one of those? A guy got onto the subway here once with one of those, acting all proud of himself. The entire carfull of people laughed at him and a couple people blurted out "You spent 5000 on that?", I saw him a couple weeks later, and he was walking
Post Edited (Paul Baker) : 3/23/2005 6:50:13 PM GMT
I sure hope the production version is not quite so cheesy. Maybe this is an opportunity for Parallax to produce more robot 'brains'!
and yeah allan...you're right, Parallax could jump all over this.
The new parallax slogan after this erector-vomit rolls out should be:
"Is spending $300 for a starter kit leaving you Vexxed? Why not try the BoeBot kit at half the price!"
[noparse]:)[/noparse]
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daniel woolston
Teksystems Inc.
www.danwoolston.com
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That is the sadest robot kit I've ever seen...
They've basically takne a 6channel RC set and an Erector-set rip-off and bundled it together?
No wonder they don't even list all the components...
There's no mention of what kind of motors are used for propulsion.
(I bet it's ordinary DC motors as used in cheap RC cars)
They suggest BENDING the metal pieces, which will mean that after you've used them once, they will no longer be perfectly straight no matter how carefully you try to straighten them, so subsequent builds will be less and less accurate.
My guess is that the designer had a small accident on his Segway...
(Didn't they have a problem with tipping over when the batteries were low?)
The sad thing is that some people will buy this thinking it's a great kit (because you know, it *has* to be good, it cost $300.00!)
Ryan
I definately love how you spend $300 just to twisty tie on the battery pack. [noparse]:)[/noparse]
Now, Now! Let's not pick on the twist-tie! Not that I'm defending the VEX, but the basis is that
of a robot built by children, (mostly High School) and using whatever they can lay their hands on..
So, Someone couldn't find the propper battery straps, and one of the other students just happened
to have his lunch bag sitting nearby, with a non-ziplock sandwhich bag, held closed by a,
You guessed it, a twist tie!
Having attended the North-East regional F.I.R.S.T. robotics competition, You have to admit, these kids
are pretty inventive on their designs, starting with just the bare metal items, (controllers, Motor speed
controls, a mini compressor, hydraulic fittings, etc.) It was up to the kids, their teachers, and their mentors
to assemble, and program their own robot, for the task put to them by F.I.R.S.T., and believe me, some
of the designs these kids made, were pretty outrageous! Even the kids I gave a lift to, (team 1124, the
U'Ber-Bots, (Avon High School, Connecticut, USA), theirs looked like a mobile crane, and it did its job!
I'm sure not defending the price! But, the 2ndary remote & reciever, for $129 USD, actually is fairly
average. Concidering I just shelled out $150 for a Futuba FT4Y 4-channel remote & reciever for
model aircraft. 2 more channels, for $30 less? Bargain!
Remember folks, we probably said the same thing about the BS2, when it first came out, and we were
still pounding away with the 4Mhz Z80, the 1Mhz 6502 (can you say SYM & KIM ), our first real microcontrollers
like the 8031, 8041, etc..
I've been assaulted by RadioShaft's (no, that's not a typo) sales mongers. I've told a few off too,
(No, I do not want to buy a Tandy-1000. I asked if you could look up the part number for the TRS-80
Model 100 service manual! ) They are vultures! Plenty of answers to questions I haven't even asked!
(and never intended to!)
But, let's see what the VEX develops into.. It's just starting out.. Let's see what it developes into, before we
start trashing it.. Who knows? Maybe, the team with the winning edge, could be using a BS2 as a
power-processor
Stephen (gelfling6)
which is why my primary issue isn't with what they're selling.· its the amount that they're selling it for.·
Vex isnt the first to break into the 'starter' kit market.· there are other choices out there for cheaper.· as i'm sure you're already aware of, bots can typically be built much cheaper outside of 'kits'.· The quality of this kit doesnt scream $300 to me.· But hey...anybody is welcome to sell whatever they want.· If people dont think its a good value or that the quality of the product is Smile; they'll quit buying them and the company will suffer because of it (tandy puters for example.)
my second beef with the kit, really isnt against vex or f.i.r.s.t. at all..its the fact that radio shack is pushing these over-priced erector sets as a revolutionary starter kit, when they're already stocking the boe-bot kit.
but like you said...we'll see what it becomes.
anything to get robots into the hands of kids is a positive idea.· i just wish their idea didnt run $300.
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daniel woolston
Teksystems Inc.
www.danwoolston.com
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(I do medieval re-enactments) and robotics at the same time.. My BOE-Bot rolled over in my car, onto a pile of knitted
Euro-4-in-1 16-guage/5/16" I.D. maille, and shorted the 9V battery posts, taking with it, the 4-AA Cell pack, & the wire.
the 1st pack, wired with the wins inside, so I tried to solder a new Coaxial & cable to outside.. MELTED again. 2nd,
I conneced a replacement coaxial to the mounted wires.. Too short! had to remount battery pack = ways instead of ||...)
I might still look at their 2nd radio remote/receiver, for the BOE, IF it's compatible. (remember, we are dealing
with Radioshaft, and if you remember their 1st MS-DOS computer, the Tandy-2000 was a BOMB.)
Stephen (gelfling6)
do you realize how hilarious that sounds? "i shorted out my robot on my chain mail armor."
lmao...
sorry bout your bot tho...but it does make for a damn funny story tho...
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daniel woolston
Teksystems Inc.
www.danwoolston.com
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Shorting out your 'bot on your maille is wonderfully anachronistic...
(can't even afford a coif...sigh)
Where do you "play"?
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Truly Understand the Fundamentals and the Path will be so much easier...
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Chris Savage
Parallax Tech Support
csavage@parallax.com
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daniel woolston
Teksystems Inc.
www.danwoolston.com
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who suggested making a suit of armor for the bots, what had happened..
For Tom's question, I usually spectate quite a few ren-faires up here in New England & NY.
(The NY Reniassance faire in Tuxedo, NY., King Richards Faire in Carver, Mass. ,
Connecticut Reniassance faire in Woodstock, Conn. , and I seem to have a full part
in a mini faire held in Prospect, Conn.)
Well, how it happened, was quite innocent.. I had the BOE Bot sitting on a box on my car seat, and on the seat
just below the box, was a sheet of maille I had knitted.. I took a left turn, and the BOE-Bot, rolled off the box, landing
head-first on the rings.. I could smell something burning, but thought it was the car in front of me.. till I
glanced right, to see smoke rising from the battery pack..
Glad to say, even though I had to mickey-mouse the new battery pack, the bot is just fine!
Though, a wee bit of blasphemy.. I lost one of the end caps from the IR LED tubes.. So...
I went to radioshaft, and picked-up a pair of Panel mount LED Holders.. Now, the IR LEDs
are chrome-plated, and really look like eyes!
Stephen (gelfling6)
Post Edited (gelfling6) : 4/15/2005 11:55:32 PM GMT
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daniel woolston
Teksystems Inc.
www.danwoolston.com
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The last Faire I attended in that area was about 15 years ago just outside of Annapolis, Picked up a pretty dagger from Mastersmith Daniel Watson of Angel Sword. Now I can only get to the local ones in North and South Carolina and occasionally outside of Atlanta.
Hail and well-met!
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Truly Understand the Fundamentals and the Path will be so much easier...
Tom, Ah! Okay, Seen it listed on faires.com. I picked-up my 1st sword back 3 years ago at the faire in Prospect, CT., and I've
had it ever since.. Nothing grand, just a short norman sword. Seemed to fit my costume best.
quite a few up this direction (north-east USA) I haven't been to.. Usually just the 4 closest. (tuxedo, NY, Carver, MA.,
Prospect & Woodstock, CT. )
Hazzah! and also well-met good sir! May our journeys cross again!
For Bishop, who asked for the picture, are we talking the new IR LED shields? or the smoked battery pack?
both, just need to download them from the camera.
Stephen