Tools and Editor Overload

As a non-expert user I have been amazed and overwhelmed by the explosion in Prop tools and editors.
Is it possible for someone to summarize the overall state-of-play and give a simple one-paragraph explanation of some of the software appearing on the forum, including;
SpinEdit, Pnut, FastSpin, PythonP2, PropGCC, OpenSpin, Spin2GUI, Spin2cpp, TAQOZ.
It would be useful to know the front-runners, so as a newcomer we do not invest too much learning time and effort on a loser tool or editor.
I have spent too much time in my life already learning a language or system, only for it to fall by the wayside and become overtaken by a winner.

Comments

  • David
    PropWare: C++ HAL (Hardware Abstraction Layer) for PropGCC; Robust build system using CMake; Integrated Simple Library, libpropeller, and libPropelleruino (Arduino port); Instructions for Eclipse and JetBrain's CLion; Example projects; Doxygen documentation
    CI Server: http://david.zemon.name:8111/?guest=1
  • SpinEdit: editor with syntax highlighting for .spin2 files
    FastSpin: Command-line compiler for a variety of languages, including Spin, PBasic, and (a little bit of) C. Various graphical tools use it.
    PythonP2: I think by this you mean the Python P2 loader. It's just a tool for loading binaries to the P2
    PropGCC: the GCC-based compiler originally designed for the P1. May or may not be used as a starting point for porting GCC to the P2.
    OpenSpin: An open source Spin compiler for P1.
    Spin2GUI: Basic GUI text editor around fastspin and a loader (different ones for P1 and P2).
    Spin2Cpp: Command-line compiler for a variety of languages... I don't want to get anything wrong, so I won't try to list them all as I haven't used it. I know it was originally designed to convert Spin to C++ but has since evolved immensely.
    TAQOZ: A Forth interpreter which just so happens to be burned into the P2's ROM.

    Pnut is the tool in your list made by Parallax themselves (maybe Chip?). It's Windows only. I haven't used it or even downloaded it.
    David
    PropWare: C++ HAL (Hardware Abstraction Layer) for PropGCC; Robust build system using CMake; Integrated Simple Library, libpropeller, and libPropelleruino (Arduino port); Instructions for Eclipse and JetBrain's CLion; Example projects; Doxygen documentation
    CI Server: http://david.zemon.name:8111/?guest=1
  • What do you use to program the P1, Macrobeak?
  • DavidZ, thanks for that excellent summary and comments. It is a good starting point.
    Tubular, I have only used SPIN on Prop Tool with Viewport for some debugging, graphing and development.
    Clearly I am a dinosaur and have to upgrade my tools!
  • From your past history it seems that yes, you have only used Spin.

    Looking at what you were trying to achieve though I cannot help but think "If only he had used the Forth".
    Ethernet servers? Yes! Ping sensors? Yes! Interactive robotic development? Yes! Fast? Yes! Tools? No! (just an editor and a terminal)

    Tachyon Forth - compact, fast, forthwright and interactive
    useforthlogo-s.png
    --->CLICK THE LOGO for more links<---
    P2 +++++ TAQOZ INTRO & LINKS +++++ P2 SHORTFORM DATASHEET
    P1 +++++ Latest binary V5.4 includes EASYFILE +++++ Tachyon Forth News Blog
    Brisbane, Australia
  • I'm guessing PropGCC there is Dave Hein's p2gcc, correct?

    "There's no huge amount of massive material
    hidden in the rings that we can't see,
    the rings are almost pure ice."
  • Excuse my ignorance regarding Prop C language tools, but what is the difference between Parallax SimpleIDE and PropGCC?
  • Back in 2011 proplem posted an emacs mode for the Prop: https://forums.parallax.com/discussion/131311/emacs-propeller-mode-available

    Needs updating for Prop2 keywords and file extensions - is proplem still about?
  • macrobeak wrote: »
    Excuse my ignorance regarding Prop C language tools, but what is the difference between Parallax SimpleIDE and PropGCC?
    PropGCC consists of command-line programs to compile and link C and C++ programs. SimpleIDE has a graphical user interface that contains an editor, terminal emulator and allows compiling using the GUI. It invokes PropGCC to perform the compiling and linking.

  • From your past history it seems that yes, you have only used Spin.

    Looking at what you were trying to achieve though I cannot help but think "If only he had used the Forth".
    Ethernet servers? Yes! Ping sensors? Yes! Interactive robotic development? Yes! Fast? Yes! Tools? No! (just an editor and a terminal)

    I love your efforts with Forth. I'm glad it's included in the ROM. I wish, however, it was documented better. I love the concept, I get through most of the tutorials you have - and then hit a bottleneck on all of the advanced features you have, at which point I'm looking through code samples trying to figure stuff out.

    On a side note - I saw a twitter post by Ken today about which languages for future Propeller development should Parallax offer. I didn't see Taqoz Forth, but wish it had been... Even though this will be an "embedded" tool for expert use, I REALLY wish this could get more attention.

    At the end of the day, I would love to design systems with higher end controllers (i.e. PLCs and PCs) using the Prop2 for a "smart" IO controller running Taqoz Forth, that I can modify as needed, and never need to re-burn firmware onto. I love that I can just utilize a serial port interface to the P2 to open up a whole world of IO possibilities with the P2. I'm very much looking forward to designing around this using a soft PLC like Codesys running on SBCs like the Raspberry Pi with a serial interfaced P2 port, or a bare metal Ultibo on the Raspberry Pi talking to a serial interfaced P2 board.
  • @fixmax - Thanks "max" :)

    Both Tachyon and TAQOZ were developed so that I could get work done and still use the Propeller chip. If I were a tools dev I could concentrate on the tools and maybe have collaborators to help out as well including documentation. But alas, I am too busy using it and also designing and building new boards etc. What Tachyon/TAQOZ has always needed are committed volunteers who can get on-board and be part of the development and documentation process. It's a hard ask for one guy at the best of times, and these have not been the best of times for me either.

    Since Parallax is focused on school education and not college level stuff I think they will probably stick with (and be stuck with) Blockly mostly. However I know that at university level especially in engineering that using Forth is not uncommon since it cuts through the abstraction layers of the tools and allows interaction with the actual hardware, especially esoteric designs. It seems to me that since the Propeller is an embedded chip for embedded systems and practically all users are dealing with hardware and to some extent "esoteric" designs, that TAQOZ should be promoted to some extent in this area at least, or at least "mentioned" as an alternative.

    Tachyon Forth - compact, fast, forthwright and interactive
    useforthlogo-s.png
    --->CLICK THE LOGO for more links<---
    P2 +++++ TAQOZ INTRO & LINKS +++++ P2 SHORTFORM DATASHEET
    P1 +++++ Latest binary V5.4 includes EASYFILE +++++ Tachyon Forth News Blog
    Brisbane, Australia
  • From your past history it seems that yes, you have only used Spin.

    Looking at what you were trying to achieve though I cannot help but think "If only he had used the Forth".
    Ethernet servers? Yes! Ping sensors? Yes! Interactive robotic development? Yes! Fast? Yes! Tools? No! (just an editor and a terminal)

    Peter, thanks for the recommendation, I will bear it in mind. I have observed your incredible commitment and hard work in developing and FORTH for the Prop I and II and I wish you well in your efforts.
  • I've been using Pnut and it seems to work fine, but miss having my code highlighted. I haven't been able to find where to get a copy of Spinedit. Can someone point me to the right place to download it?
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