Thanks Bill... I think I might be one of the lunatics too 

I think (well I hope) that we know when to use spin and when to use PASM (or LMM, etc). And in many cases it's OK to use spin to test a theory and if more speed is required, convert it to PASM.

Chip: Thanks for your comments too. There has been a lot of flack in this thread. SPIN is fantastically simple provided you keep the summary nearby for the obscure operators. SPIN is just so simple to get started.

How many micro chips can you get running with a couple of statements? I only know of ONE. Each time I think about other micros, I remember the time it takes to get a basic set of instructions working. Admittedly, you only have to do this once for a shell, but you do have to get all the register hardware definitions setup before the micro will do anything simple, even flash a LED. The prop can turn a LED on in 2 lines (DIR and OUT).

How simple is this to make a LED flash (the repeat 10000 may need adjusting - I haven't tried it)

I defy you to show me ANY C program that does any kind of minimal user I/O that does not requires a header file usage.

To qualify for the challenge I or anyone has to be able to cut and paste the code you give us AS IS without any additions or modifications into a C compiler and be able to compile and run it.(BTW pasting the header file inside the program as a whole is a cheat and is not allowed).

Here is a pseudo code for a minimal program ..... I defy you to implement it in a C program without having to use a header file.......I mean without an #include of any kind.

==============

Prompt user for  a name

Obtain the name

Prompt the user for year of birth

Obtain year

Calculate Age

Display "Hello "+User Name+" you are "+Age+" years old"

==============

Very simple...no? If you can show me a program that implements the above pseudo code without having a single #include in it ..... I will retract my words....if not then you must admit that saying "Thats dead wrong" is dead wrong.............

Or even better......show me a program in C that can accomplish what Cluso99's program shown above in Spin does. And I mean flashing an actual LED not a screen simulated one. But I will grant you a simulated screen one too.

If you can show me a C program that can do that without the use of any #include files then you are a GURU.

Sam

As a metapher my metaphor might be wrong.

But as a metaphor you have not gotten the point. Your advice is not necessarily the one I want to go with. I want to be able to do my own thinking by myself. I want the freedom to do what I want. I do not want to be restricted by people who think that they know what is best for me and everybody else.

I want a system that allows freedom of choice. I am able to decide by myself and am able to take the responsibility for my own action.

Sam

Hi Ross,

I think the Catalina is AWESOME........How is the BOLDED extern resolved upon compiling? What do I use for input and output?

Unfortunately I cannot try the program. I am not versed with the Catalina. But I think that you can do such a thing on the Propeller is a wonderful testament to the Propeller.

I can do the above very easily with Spin too and I can do it on any platform for the propeller. I can use FullDuplexSerial which is my favored method since I can do both Keyboard Input and Screen output all in one cog and on the development platform.

I can use TV_Text/ VGA_Text and Keyboard.....but then I have to wire up and plug in a keyboard and a TV/VGA screen.

But the point is that SPIN gives me the choices and the abilities to do things the way I want.

Also I am very interested to see the equivalent to Cluso99's program above in Catalina.

I do admire and applaud your work with the Catalina.....if I get the time some time I WILL DEFINITELY try it out....it is worthy of admiration......

Unfortunately I have limited time.....I do not know how you guys on this forum can manage such AWESOME work and still SLEEP.

A very important point HOWEVER.....I picked up the Propeller and with Spin in a day I was able to write programs that accomplished AMAZING things that had me jumping for joy at what I saw being done. (e.g. blinking two LEDs totally independently with their own timing).

If I were to do the same with anything other than SPIN I would have not done it in a DAY....A DAY......this is the MOST IMPORTANT thing about SPIN.............any one can pick it up and be productive on the propeller with it IN A SHORT TIME............later if one requires more power he has the CHOICE to use PASM and the FLEXIBILITY of the OBEX objects and and and..........

So SPIN is  EASY, CAPABLE, and is the best way to get things done with the propeller even for a novice to  programming.

The main thing is that it allows FLEXIBILITY combined with ABILITY.

I am reading your posts.......I find nothing but insulting critical naive nonsense...........here is one .....

Post Edited (potatohead) : 11/3/2009 4:00:51 PM GMT

This C program would flash an LED just like the Spin program would.  I even formatted it to look like Spin.  All the #define's could be collected into a header file so the average programmer wouldn't need to see all the gory details.  That's the power of using the #include directive in C.

Dave

#define Pub        extern
#define repeatn(x) {int i; for (i = 0; i < x; i++);}
#define repeat     while(1){
#define OUTA (*(long *)0x1f4)
#define DIRA (*(long *)0x1f6)
#define dira(x, y) DIRA = (DIRA & (~(1 << x))) | (y << x);
#define outa(x, y) OUTA = (OUTA & (~(1 << x))) | (y << x);

Pub main(void) {    //make a LED flash
  dira(23, 1)       //make pin 23 output (has resistor and LED attached)
  repeat
    outa(23, 1)     //pin 23 = 1
    repeatn(1000)   //delay
    outa(23, 0)     //pin 23 = 0
    repeatn(1000)}} //delay