TAQOZ - Tachyon Forth for the P2 BOOT ROM

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  • jmgjmg Posts: 12,618
    TAQOZ itself is now frozen in ROM and Chip is making images available. I've attached the combined source and listing.

    Great :)

    Is there a table yet, of the various boot-paths and boot times for each ?
    There were comments about making boot faster ?

  • Peter JakackiPeter Jakacki Posts: 7,868
    edited May 30 Vote Up0Vote Down
    Unfortunately, the SD boot is not that fast because it is meant to be callable and so runs in hubexec mode which slows things down because of a tight loop. If it is called at full clock speed it won't be so bad but the booter however could load a 2nd stage minimal SD booter which could operate from cog at 2.5MHz SPI speeds even at 20MHz clock rate but of course could switch to a 200MHz clock and run at 25MHz SPI speeds. So that would make 2 stage SD booting very fast. This is also how Chip has the SPI Flash working, as it is meant to load in a 2nd stage that can then ramp up the clock etc.

    TAQOZ itself runs separate SPI read/write routines in cog so even at 20MHz the SPI speeds are 2.5Mhz.

    BTW, the 2nd stage loader is probably the way most code will end up loading as we explore the P2 and find better ways of doing things. If we could use the smartpins for SPI bus I think we can access SD at 50MHz SPI speeds as the old standard back in 2003 specified 25MHz max but IIRC this was upgraded to 50MHz.

    Tachyon Forth - compact, fast, forthwright and interactive
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  • ErNaErNa Posts: 1,223
    "how ingrained our thinking becomes because that is how we are so used to writing programs"
    That gives hope. Our thinking is not ingrained, it becomes ingrained. And that can be changed. We have to adapt our successful thinking to programming. First look into your purse: 300$, then spend the money. Not spend (300), then realize, nothing to spend!
    The world mist the train when HP overprized the HP35 and TI introduced the cheap "scientific calculators for pupils".
    The advantage now is: tachyon in frozen in silicon and there will always be a fallback when progress comes to fast to keep track ;-)
    Thanks to all for the great work!
    no reason to reason if you feel feelings: in love with the propeller
  • Peter JakackiPeter Jakacki Posts: 7,868
    edited September 28 Vote Up0Vote Down
    Now that Chip has P2 silicon working I will try to keep anything to do with TAQOZ in this thread and so I'm reposting this about selecting 180MHZ for testing although I will have to add in a line to change the console baud rate as well.
    So to select 180MHZ from TAQOZ would be:
    %1_000000_0000001000_1111_10_00 HUBSET 200,000 WAITX %1_000000_0000001000_1111_10_11 HUBSET
    

    and making a new word so we can switch it easily (but lose console baud rate):
    : 180MHZ      %1_000000_0000001000_1111_10_00 HUBSET 200,000 WAITX %1_000000_0000001000_1111_10_11 HUBSET ;
    

    Type WORDS or hit ^W to list the dictionary where you will find words such as RCSLOW etc.
    ----------------------------------------------------------------
      Parallax P2  .:.:--TAQOZ--:.:.  V1.0--142          180530-0135
    ----------------------------------------------------------------
    TAQOZ# WORDS 
    DUP OVER SWAP ROT -ROT DROP 3RD 4TH 2DROP 3DROP NIP 2SWAP 2DUP ?DUP AND 
    ANDN OR XOR ROL ROR >> << SAR 2/ 2* 4/ 4* 8<< 16>> 8>> 9<< 9>> REV |< >| 
    >N >B >9 BITS NOT = <> 0= 0<> 0< < U< > U> <= => WITHIN DUPC@ C@ W@ @ C+! 
    C! C@++ W+! W! +! ! BIT! SET CLR SET? 1+ 1- 2+ 2- 4+ + - UM* * W* / U/ 
    U// // */ UM// C++ C-- W++ W-- ++ -- RND GETRND SQRT SETDACS ~ ~~ W~ W~~ 
    C~ C~~ L>S >W L>W W>B W>L B>W B>L MINS MAXS MIN MAX ABS -NEGATE ?NEGATE 
    NEGATE ON TRUE -1 FALSE OFF GOTO IF ELSE THEN BEGIN UNTIL AGAIN WHILE REPEAT 
    SWITCH CASE@ CASE= CASE> BREAK CASE ADO DO LOOP +LOOP FOR NEXT ?NEXT I 
    J LEAVE IC@ I+ BOUNDS H L T F R HIGH LOW FLOAT PIN@ WRPIN WXPIN WYPIN RDPIN 
    RQPIN AKPIN WAITPIN WRACK PIN @PIN ns PW PULSE PULSES HILO DUTY NCO HZ 
    KHZ MHZ MUTE BLINK PWM SAW BIT BAUD TXD RXD TXDAT WAITX WAITCNT REBOOT 
    RESET 0EXIT EXIT NOP CALL JUMP >R R> >L L> !SP DEPTH COG@ COG! LUT@ LUT! 
    COGID COGINIT COGSTOP NEWCOG COGATN POLLATN SETEDG POLLEDG KEY WKEY KEY! 
    CON NONE COM CONKEY CONEMIT SEROUT EMIT EMITS CRLF CR CLS SPACE SPACES 
    RAM DUMP: DUMP DUMPW DUMPL DUMPA DUMPAW QD QW DEBUG lsio COG LUT KB MB 
    M . PRINT .AS .AS" .DECL .DEC4 HOLD #> <# # #S <D> U. .DEC .BIN .H .B .BYTE 
    .W .WORD .L .LONG .ADDR PRINT$ LEN$ " ." CTYPE ?EXIT DATA? ERASE FILL CMOVE 
    <CMOVE s ms us CNT@ LAP LAP@ .LAP .ms HEX DEC BIN .S WORDS @WORDS GET$ 
    SEARCH $># @DATA HERE @HERE @CODES uemit ukey char delim names TASK REG 
    @WORD SPIN | || , [W] ["] NULL$ $! $= ASM FORGET CREATE$ CREATE VAR pub 
    pri pre : ; [ ] ' := ==! ALIGN DATCON ALLOT org bytes words longs byte 
    word long res [C] GRAB NFA' CPA CFA \ --- ( { } IFNDEF IFDEF TAQOZ TERM 
    AUTO SPIRD SPIRDL SPIWB SPICE SPIWC SPIWW SPIWM SPIWL SPIPINS SPIRX SPITXE 
    SPITX WSLED WAIT CLKDIV RCSLOW HUBSET WP WE CLKHZ ERROR SFPINS SF? SFWE 
    SFINS SFWD SFSID SFJID SFER4 SFER32 SFER64 SFERASE SFWRPG BACKUP RESTORE 
    SFRDS SFWRS SFC@ SFW@ SF@ SF .SF SDBUF sdpins MOUNT DIR !SD !SX SD? CMD 
    ACMD cid SDWR SDRDS SDWRS FLUSH FOPEN FLOAD FGET FREAD FWRITE SECTOR SDRD 
    SDRDS SDADR SD@ SD! SDC@ SDC! SDW@ SD @FAT @BOOT @ROOT fat END  433 ok
    
    Another quick demo on P2 of P2 to generate a 10% PWM with a resolution of 1,000 counts with minimum clock division.
    TAQOZ# 2 PIN 100 1000 1 PWM  ok
    TAQOZ#
    

    When I get a chip next week I will go through the clock and analog modes as well.

    Tachyon Forth - compact, fast, forthwright and interactive
    useforthlogo-s.png
    --->CLICK THE LOGO for more links<---
    Latest binary V5.4 includes EASYFILE +++++ Tachyon Forth News Blog
    P2 SHORTFORM DATASHEET +++++ TAQOZ documentation
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  • Now that Chip has P2 silicon working I will try to keep anything to do with TAQOZ in this thread and so I'm reposting this about selecting 180MHZ for testing although I will have to add in a line to change the console baud rate as well.
    When I get a chip next week I will go through the clock and analog modes as well.

    Some forth code to generate Analog ramps/triangles/sines would be nice to see :)


  • jmg wrote: »
    Now that Chip has P2 silicon working I will try to keep anything to do with TAQOZ in this thread and so I'm reposting this about selecting 180MHZ for testing although I will have to add in a line to change the console baud rate as well.
    When I get a chip next week I will go through the clock and analog modes as well.

    Some forth code to generate Analog ramps/triangles/sines would be nice to see :)


    Yes, I'm really interested in the analog part so I will be posting scope shots as well as code and observations.
    This is how we ramp PWM from 0 to 100% continually until a key is pressed.
    BEGIN 2 PIN 1000 0 DO I 1000 1 PWM 100 us LOOP KEY UNTIL
    

    Tachyon Forth - compact, fast, forthwright and interactive
    useforthlogo-s.png
    --->CLICK THE LOGO for more links<---
    Latest binary V5.4 includes EASYFILE +++++ Tachyon Forth News Blog
    P2 SHORTFORM DATASHEET +++++ TAQOZ documentation
    Brisbane, Australia
  • Awesome, Peter. These one-liners are going to really show off the smartpins without the fear of forth.
  • Peter JakackiPeter Jakacki Posts: 7,868
    edited September 29 Vote Up0Vote Down
    One liners are handy but extending TAQOZ with your own words is easy too. Here I set pin 2 as a 20M baud UART transmit line, create a transmit string word so that I can pass the string and the pin number to it, and of course I test it.
    TAQOZ# : TRANSMIT$ ( string pin -- ) PIN DUP LEN$ TXDAT ;  ok
    TAQOZ# 2 PIN 20 M TXD  ok
    TAQOZ# " HELLO WORLD" 2 TRANSMIT$  ok
    

    HELLO%20WORLD.png
    (20M was the limit of the scope's decoder)
    800 x 480 - 37K

    Tachyon Forth - compact, fast, forthwright and interactive
    useforthlogo-s.png
    --->CLICK THE LOGO for more links<---
    Latest binary V5.4 includes EASYFILE +++++ Tachyon Forth News Blog
    P2 SHORTFORM DATASHEET +++++ TAQOZ documentation
    Brisbane, Australia
  • Yes, I'm really interested in the analog part so I will be posting scope shots as well as code and observations.
    This is how we ramp PWM from 0 to 100% continually until a key is pressed.
    BEGIN 2 PIN 1000 0 DO I 1000 1 PWM 100 us LOOP KEY UNTIL
    

    Those one liners for a novice are a little hard, so I rolled out this line cmapspublic3.ihmc.us/rid=1SX77GSL1-ZZZBPJ-1LND/TAQOZ_One-liner_PWM.cmap to gain a better understanding

    no reason to reason if you feel feelings: in love with the propeller
  • Cluso99Cluso99 Posts: 14,253
    edited September 29 Vote Up0Vote Down
    Erna, great explanation thanks. Really makes it easy to understand :)
    My Prop boards: P8XBlade2, RamBlade, CpuBlade, TriBlade
    Prop OS (also see Sphinx, PropDos, PropCmd, Spinix)
    Website: www.clusos.com
    Prop Tools (Index) , Emulators (Index) , ZiCog (Z80)
  • Cluso99 wrote: »
    Erna, great explanation thanks. Really makes it easy to understand :)
    Me2
    Jim

  • That is nice Erna.

    BTW: I wonder if we can combine Blockly with the built in P2 Forth...
    Prop Info and Apps: http://www.rayslogic.com/
  • ...or the first thing it does is either:

    Send a dictionary over to augment TAQOS, or a full featured Tachyon.

    Do not taunt Happy Fun Ball! @opengeekorg ---> Be Excellent To One Another SKYPE = acuity_doug
    Parallax colors simplified: https://forums.parallax.com/discussion/123709/commented-graphics-demo-spin<br>
  • potatohead wrote: »
    ...or the first thing it does is either:

    Send a dictionary over to augment TAQOS, or a full featured Tachyon.
    I wouldn't think this would be the best way to get BlocklyProp working with the P2. Wouldn't it be better to use p2gcc since BlocklyProp is already setup to generate C code?

  • Blockly is a "code generator" and is capable of being extended to a variety of languages...

    But, you are right that since we already have BlocklyProp, there maybe wouldn't be much to gain with that approach...
    Prop Info and Apps: http://www.rayslogic.com/
  • David, I agree. The question was about Blockly and the built in Forth.

    If one were to go that route, initializing things would likely mean a dictionary, or Tachyon be sent over.

    The basic point being Forth can take a plaintext load and will operate on that to dial in features needed.

    Do not taunt Happy Fun Ball! @opengeekorg ---> Be Excellent To One Another SKYPE = acuity_doug
    Parallax colors simplified: https://forums.parallax.com/discussion/123709/commented-graphics-demo-spin<br>
  • potatohead wrote: »
    David, I agree. The question was about Blockly and the built in Forth.

    If one were to go that route, initializing things would likely mean a dictionary, or Tachyon be sent over.

    The basic point being Forth can take a plaintext load and will operate on that to dial in features needed.
    Yeah but if you send a full Tachyon over then it's no different than sending a compiled C program. I agree that it would be cool if you could just use Taqos directly. I don't see any reason BlocklyProp couldn't be made to generate code for it but it would not achieve one of Parallax's goals which is to let people write in BlocklyProp and then see the generated C code as a way to learn C.

  • Totally.

    Part of me wonders though. And make no mistake. I am not gonna do this, but:

    Making ones own blocks, then assembling would be a Forth kind of thing. I do wonder what people would do with that idea presented visually.
    Do not taunt Happy Fun Ball! @opengeekorg ---> Be Excellent To One Another SKYPE = acuity_doug
    Parallax colors simplified: https://forums.parallax.com/discussion/123709/commented-graphics-demo-spin<br>
  • Peter JakackiPeter Jakacki Posts: 7,868
    edited October 8 Vote Up0Vote Down
    Hopefully I can get around to testing the analog and various smartpin modes today. In the meantime here's a fibo benchmark that's run at 280MHz just for the test and then I drop back to 180MHz.
    TAQOZ# 280 M CLOCK  ok
    TAQOZ# 1 46 ADO CRLF ." fibo(" I . ." ) = " LAP I fibo  LAP .LAP ."  result =" . 5 +LOOP 
    fibo(1) = 458 cycles = 1,635ns @280MHz result =1
    fibo(6) = 778 cycles = 2,778ns @280MHz result =8
    fibo(11) = 1,098 cycles = 3,921ns @280MHz result =89
    fibo(16) = 1,418 cycles = 5,064ns @280MHz result =987
    fibo(21) = 1,738 cycles = 6,207ns @280MHz result =10946
    fibo(26) = 2,058 cycles = 7,350ns @280MHz result =121393
    fibo(31) = 2,378 cycles = 8,492ns @280MHz result =1346269
    fibo(36) = 2,698 cycles = 9,635ns @280MHz result =14930352
    fibo(41) = 3,018 cycles = 10,778ns @280MHz result =165580141
    fibo(46) = 3,338 cycles = 11,921ns @280MHz result =1836311903 ok
    TAQOZ# 180 M CLOCK  ok
    

    Tachyon Forth - compact, fast, forthwright and interactive
    useforthlogo-s.png
    --->CLICK THE LOGO for more links<---
    Latest binary V5.4 includes EASYFILE +++++ Tachyon Forth News Blog
    P2 SHORTFORM DATASHEET +++++ TAQOZ documentation
    Brisbane, Australia
  • Peter JakackiPeter Jakacki Posts: 7,868
    edited October 8 Vote Up0Vote Down
    Copy and paste this text into TAQOZ to change the clock rate seamlessly. The console baud rate is automatically adjusted as well.
    You can access the individual clock hubset fields or just pass a frequency value to CLOCK like this:
    250 M CLOCK
    
    BTW - I standardized on 2M baud at boot but just change if your terminal is not up to it.
    long _baud 2 M _baud !
    
    TAQOZ
    ( CLOCK MODES )
    ---	 1098_7654_321098_7654321098_7654_32_10
    ---	 0000_000E_DDDDDD_MMMMMMMMMM_PPPP_CC_SS
    long _clk   _clk ~
    long _fin
    --- set the
    : CLKSET 	_clk @ HUBSET ;
    ( PLL should run between 100 to 200MHz )
    : CLK! ( data mask -- )	_clk @ SWAP ANDN OR _clk ! ;
    : PLLEN		24 |< _clk SET ;
    : PLLOFF	24 |< _clk CLR ;
    
    : XIDIV ( 1..64 -- ) 	1- $1F AND 18 << $00FC0000 CLK! ;
    ( ends up as multiply)
    : VCOMUL ( 1..1024 -- ) 1- $3FF AND 8 << $3FF00 CLK! ;
    --- Divide the PLL by 1 2 4 6 ... 30 for the system clock when SS = %11
    : PLLDIV ( 2..30 -- ) 	2/ 1- $0F AND 4 << $0F0 CLK! ;
    : CLKSRC	CLKSET DUP 1 > IF 200,000 WAITX THEN 3 AND 3 CLK! CLKSET ;
    
    : USEPLL 	3 CLKSRC ;
    : USEXTAL	2 CLKSRC ;
    : RCSLOW	1 HUBSET _clk ~ ;
    : RCFAST	0 HUBSET _clk ~ ;
    
    : CC		3 AND 2 << $0C CLK! ;
    : 15PF		2 CC ;
    : 30PF		3 CC ;
    : 0PF		1 CC ;
    : XPF		0 CC ;
    
    long _baud 2 M _baud !
    : CONBAUD	DUP _baud ! 63 PIN DUP RXD 62 PIN TXD ;
    --- Set P2 CLOCK to selected MHZ ( simple PLL settings only )
    : CLOCK ( HZ --- )
    	' CLKHZ 2+ !
    	30PF PLLEN 12 XIDIV CLKHZ 1000000 U/ VCOMUL 1 PLLDIV USEPLL
    	_baud @ CONBAUD
    	;
    END
    

    Tachyon Forth - compact, fast, forthwright and interactive
    useforthlogo-s.png
    --->CLICK THE LOGO for more links<---
    Latest binary V5.4 includes EASYFILE +++++ Tachyon Forth News Blog
    P2 SHORTFORM DATASHEET +++++ TAQOZ documentation
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  • Thanks Peter

    When we type 250 M CLOCK we get action but the current jumps crazy high. We're proceeding with caution.
  • I'm not all that game to overclock the P2 for too long but here is a FOR NEXT loop timing and a fibo result for 340MHz:
    TAQOZ# 340 M CLOCK LAP 1000000 FOR NEXT LAP .LAP 80 M CLOCK 32,000,154 cycles = 94,118,100ns @340MHz ok
    
    That is around 94ns per loop!
    TAQOZ# 340 M CLOCK  ok
    TAQOZ# 1 46 ADO CRLF ." fibo(" I . ." ) = " LAP I fibo  LAP .LAP ."  result =" . 5 +LOOP 
    fibo(1) = 480 cycles = 1,411ns @340MHz result =1411
    fibo(6) = 800 cycles = 2,352ns @340MHz result =2352
    fibo(11) = 1,120 cycles = 3,294ns @340MHz result =3294
    fibo(16) = 1,440 cycles = 4,235ns @340MHz result =4235
    fibo(21) = 1,760 cycles = 5,176ns @340MHz result =5176
    fibo(26) = 2,080 cycles = 6,117ns @340MHz result =6117
    fibo(31) = 2,400 cycles = 7,058ns @340MHz result =7058
    fibo(36) = 2,720 cycles = 8,000ns @340MHz result =8000
    fibo(41) = 3,040 cycles = 8,941ns @340MHz result =8941
    fibo(46) = 3,360 cycles = 9,882ns @340MHz result =9882 ok
    TAQOZ# 100 M CLOCK  ok
    
    Less than 10us for fibo(46) in high level threaded code.

    Tachyon Forth - compact, fast, forthwright and interactive
    useforthlogo-s.png
    --->CLICK THE LOGO for more links<---
    Latest binary V5.4 includes EASYFILE +++++ Tachyon Forth News Blog
    P2 SHORTFORM DATASHEET +++++ TAQOZ documentation
    Brisbane, Australia
  • jmgjmg Posts: 12,618
    I'm not all that game to overclock the P2 for too long ....

    Understandable !

    .. but here is a FOR NEXT loop timing and a fibo result for 340MHz.

    What Vcore, Vio and decoupling-cap-count is that 340MHz done with ?

  • Stock standard P2D2, 1.8V core and 3.3V io with fully populated board. Chip is still running the P2D2 as a simple chip carrier by the sound of it.

    Tachyon Forth - compact, fast, forthwright and interactive
    useforthlogo-s.png
    --->CLICK THE LOGO for more links<---
    Latest binary V5.4 includes EASYFILE +++++ Tachyon Forth News Blog
    P2 SHORTFORM DATASHEET +++++ TAQOZ documentation
    Brisbane, Australia
  • cgraceycgracey Posts: 10,540
    edited October 8 Vote Up0Vote Down
    Stock standard P2D2, 1.8V core and 3.3V io with fully populated board. Chip is still running the P2D2 as a simple chip carrier by the sound of it.

    Yes, with 18" grabber cables delivering the powers and ground. It's very sloppy. Just one bypass cap per VDD and VIO, too.

    If you are getting 340MHz at 1.8V, going to 2.0V with good heat dissipation could certainly get you higher.
  • Cluso99Cluso99 Posts: 14,253
    edited October 8 Vote Up0Vote Down
    Hey Chip,
    When are the next packaged chips due? About 150 at the end of month???
    Don't was to kill any of the current 9 working chips ;)

    Are there any big costs to get the remaining ~1500 packaged? And timescale?
    My Prop boards: P8XBlade2, RamBlade, CpuBlade, TriBlade
    Prop OS (also see Sphinx, PropDos, PropCmd, Spinix)
    Website: www.clusos.com
    Prop Tools (Index) , Emulators (Index) , ZiCog (Z80)
  • Peter JakackiPeter Jakacki Posts: 7,868
    edited October 11 Vote Up0Vote Down
    I converted my version of Conway's Game of Life across to TAQOZ and while I haven't yet optimized it I thought you might be interested to see it running at 340MHz while connected to the terminal at 3M baud. Forgive me for the glitchy desktop recording.

    BTW - I've found that the P2 autobauds to 3M baud reliably so I am using this as my default now.
    Dropbox link:

    Tachyon Forth - compact, fast, forthwright and interactive
    useforthlogo-s.png
    --->CLICK THE LOGO for more links<---
    Latest binary V5.4 includes EASYFILE +++++ Tachyon Forth News Blog
    P2 SHORTFORM DATASHEET +++++ TAQOZ documentation
    Brisbane, Australia
  • That's cool Peter.
    Do not taunt Happy Fun Ball! @opengeekorg ---> Be Excellent To One Another SKYPE = acuity_doug
    Parallax colors simplified: https://forums.parallax.com/discussion/123709/commented-graphics-demo-spin<br>
  • Great to see, Peter. Well done.
  • Peter, have you got the ability to boot a short flash program, deterministically, which just does a GETRND and throws it on some pins? We need to make sure it comes up differently after each reset, so we know the seeding is working in the ROM.
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