Long Range UGV

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  • xanaduxanadu Posts: 3,056
    edited March 22 Vote Up0Vote Down
    Best UPS delivery ever. I got the base color spray paint early!

    But wait, there's more! I now have a way to program everything in the field. I feel like a lot less can go wrong. Check out this box. http://www.bb-elec.com/Products/USB-Connectivity/USB-Over-Ethernet/USB-Over-Ethernet-Hub.aspx

    Yeah, it's going to save me at least one 4 hour drive, I can guarantee it. It works like a charm. Out of the box, picks up DHCP, included software found it immediately. It even lists the nomenclature of attached device. Creates a COM port just like a normal COM port. Prop has no issues communicating.

    The next tests for it are :

    1. 24 hour idle test
    2. Will it work on another subnet?
    2. High noise and latency test (probably untwist some CAT6 and reduce switch port to ~56kbps)

    I am really excited. This is huge. I could drop the rover off the minute it is physically ready, and then reprogram the 2nd Propeller anytime! Okay, providing it will work over our 3G link... Fingers crossed!!

    Edit: I couldn't help but test it over a VPN. The software does not allow for anything but the local network, no way to reach remote subnets. I took an IP outside of the DHCP pool, added a static route and viola, we have link!

    This device uses 260 mA idle, that's going to be okay...
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  • ercoerco Posts: 18,184
    Your plan sounds logical, but you may be overcomplicating. Just get a Terminator "reroute alternate power" chip or Enterprise "divert energy to impulse engines" chip, so you can focus on the more important stuff.

    "When you make a thing, a thing that is new, it is so complicated making it that it is bound to be ugly. But those that make it after you, they don’t have to worry about making it. And they can make it pretty, and so everybody can like it when others make it after you."

    - Pablo Picasso
  • Okay no giant beams on chains around the rover lol...

    I thought you were joking, eBay has everything. Free shipping for me!

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  • ercoerco Posts: 18,184
    NICE FINDS ALL! Snag me that T-1000 guide on latching relays!
    "When you make a thing, a thing that is new, it is so complicated making it that it is bound to be ugly. But those that make it after you, they don’t have to worry about making it. And they can make it pretty, and so everybody can like it when others make it after you."

    - Pablo Picasso
  • I love this color, satin khaki. The only problem is it's hard to find in Krylon Fusion. I may switch brands...

    Here's a pic. 1 can was just enough to put down a light base coat. According to youtube reviews, with a 1 week cure this stuff doesn't chip.
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  • I love the Krylon Fusion spray paint. The last time I was at WM I couldn't find that product. Krylon must have changed the product name. The can of gloss black I did buy was a bonus size. And still the same quality's: A heavy coat will dry to the touch in 30 to 60 minutes, a light coat in ten, and it will take a week or more to cure completely. I'll use it instead of Rustolium anytime, except for their rust converter paint. That stuff is amazing.

    Careful xanadu, you are going to make this too attractive for the curious. I'm guessing you picked the color as camouflage.

  • MikeDYurMikeDYur Posts: 2,051
    edited March 24 Vote Up0Vote Down
    This is the only Krylon product I could find, It's called Krylon Cover MAXX. And it could be just where I shopped, because they didn't have the usual color choices.
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  • I thought Fusion just came out. I'm always behind on these things! I'm working some ACE hardware stores, if not it doesn't matter much. The objective is to get it where people can't see it. That doesn't mean I'm not going to show it off, but I can't delay for paint. We need to get this thing out of the garage asap.

    I don't think anyone will mess with it, not where we're going.
  • ercoerco Posts: 18,184
    xanadu wrote: »
    The objective is to get it where people can't see it.

    I take it that the 400 ultrabright LEDs and 200 watts of audio demonstrated by my video back in the third post are "Right Out".

    "When you make a thing, a thing that is new, it is so complicated making it that it is bound to be ugly. But those that make it after you, they don’t have to worry about making it. And they can make it pretty, and so everybody can like it when others make it after you."

    - Pablo Picasso
  • Buck RogersBuck Rogers Posts: 1,125
    edited March 25 Vote Up0Vote Down
    By chance xanadu, or you as well erco, ever see a book by title of "Linux Robotics"? I bought it about eleven years ago in hopes of better understanding how have a fully featured computer running Linux (X86 not ARM based) manage electronics.

    The first project concerns turning a Jeb Stuart Tank (probably from Walmart!?!) from an R/C controlled kludge into a reasonably simple bot.

    One of his pet peeves is that of the power train. In fact it manifests across all of his projects. And his later ones resemble the Arlo fellow. And I even know of one Arlo design which became Doctor Who's favorite problem.

    I recommend finding a copy of that book for advice.

    Incidentally erco all of your robots are making their way home via Route 50....
  • MikeDYurMikeDYur Posts: 2,051
    edited March 24 Vote Up0Vote Down
    xanadu wrote: »
    I thought Fusion just came out. I'm always behind on these things! I'm working some ACE hardware stores, if not it doesn't matter much. The objective is to get it where people can't see it. That doesn't mean I'm not going to show it off, but I can't delay for paint. We need to get this thing out of the garage asap.

    I don't think anyone will mess with it, not where we're going.



    After the first day, you can leave your project out in the sun. It will cure that paint a little faster.
    Of course I'm talking about northern Ohio sun.
  • erco wrote: »
    xanadu wrote: »
    The objective is to get it where people can't see it.

    I take it that the 400 ultrabright LEDs and 200 watts of audio demonstrated by my video back in the third post are "Right Out".

    I have 10 watts of audio, 32 RGBs :)
    By chance xanadu, or you as well erco, ever see a book by title of "Linux Robotics"? I bought it about eleven years ago in hopes of better understanding how have a fully featured computer running Linux (X86 not ARM based) manage electronics.

    The first project concerns turning a Jeb Stuart Tank (probably from Walmart!?!) from an R/C controlled kludge into a reasonably simple bot.

    One of his pet peeves is that of the power train. In fact it manifests across all of his projects. And his later ones resemble the Arlo fellow. And I even know of one Arlo design which became Doctor Who's favorite problem.

    I recommend finding a copy of that book for advice.

    Incidentally erco all of robots are making their way home via Route 50....

    That sounds great, I found a copy for $2 if this is it. http://www.barnesandnoble.com/p/linux-robotics-d-jay-newman/1006916118/2675913660481
  • Modem problems today, lots of dead ends. I got the AT&T USB Connect 900. The TP-Link seems okay with it. AT&T said the only way I'm getting it on the air is to use a separate $50/mo contract, that would give me 1GB of data. No way. I need a mobile hotspot, cheaper than a Cradlepoint, with ethernet, and shares my current data plan. I'm going to have to shop around.

    Modem issues aside, I got the steering actuator :) It's really strong, and will only move the 2" I need to move the steering. It looks like they ran out of screws putting it together, if you look at the side facing the camera, look at the screw on the right. It's the wrong type and stripped out. This makes me wonder how waterproof it really is.

    The main issue. We need to add feedback to this thing, and keep it waterproof. The only thing I can think of right now is to use an external pot on the steering arm. Thoughts?

  • ercoerco Posts: 18,184
    Modems on rovers...

    My friend Keith worked on the Hot Wheels version of the first Mars Rover, and we heard a lot of juicy scoop from JPL in that time. The program's funding got drastically cut long before launch and they had to use as much off-the-shelf tech as possible. They actually used a US Robotics wireless modem to communicate from the rover to the lander. Yes, on Mars. VERY risky. Desperate for any form of assurance of function in extraordinary places, they pressed US Robotics for some glimmer of hope. USR only agreed to "warranty" their modem while in earth orbit. After that, all bets were off. History (and the movie "The Martian") shows us that it worked perfectly.

    This cheap linear pot would on;y work for about a minute in your dirty/dusty application. I think you need a sealed sensor, maybe embed a magnet on one of the actuator's internal gears and track rotations with a Hall effect sensor.
    "When you make a thing, a thing that is new, it is so complicated making it that it is bound to be ugly. But those that make it after you, they don’t have to worry about making it. And they can make it pretty, and so everybody can like it when others make it after you."

    - Pablo Picasso
  • Haha, that's awesome. I love stories like that. USR comes up a lot, try searching for robot modem hehe.

    Anyway, problem solved! I went and ripped a Cradlepoint out of a hospital. Just kidding. I went to the AT&T store, instead of calling them. The guy had the USB modem running in minutes. It cost a $25 activation fee, and service is shared with my current line. Cancel anytime. So now we have 6GB in the field, nothing extra per month. Whew....

    The AT&T Connect 900 USB stick has a built in card reader, and external antenna port! What a cool little device. The TP-Link works great with it. The card reader will come in handy, I think I need that space to install OpenVPN on the router. I have no idea what to do for the external antenna I will try to look it up.

    I also gave up on paint, and bought the closest color to what I have now, locally, for $3 a can. If the motors come, we could have a driving rover by the end of the weekend :)
  • ercoerco Posts: 18,184
    Now who's WE? Are you the latest DARPA-funded tech house? Boston Dynamics, watch out!
    "When you make a thing, a thing that is new, it is so complicated making it that it is bound to be ugly. But those that make it after you, they don’t have to worry about making it. And they can make it pretty, and so everybody can like it when others make it after you."

    - Pablo Picasso
  • erco wrote: »
    Now who's WE? Are you the latest DARPA-funded tech house? Boston Dynamics, watch out!

    His entire design team?

    And yes that's the book.

    And erco your robots are about half way home.
  • ercoerco Posts: 18,184
    Buck, actually my robots are swarming outside your house as we speak, recharging and computing a firing solution. Outer doors are open. Relax and have a brewski. One. Pabst. Only.
    "When you make a thing, a thing that is new, it is so complicated making it that it is bound to be ugly. But those that make it after you, they don’t have to worry about making it. And they can make it pretty, and so everybody can like it when others make it after you."

    - Pablo Picasso
  • Right now it's me vi and this TP-Link router... No connects for me.
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:44 2017 daemon.notice netifd: Interface 'ATT3G' is setting up now
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:46 2017 daemon.notice netifd: ATT3G (12807): Trying to set mode
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:47 2017 daemon.notice pppd[12822]: pppd 2.4.7 started by root, uid 0
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:48 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: abort on (BUSY)
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:48 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: abort on (NO CARRIER)
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:48 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: abort on (ERROR)
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:48 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: report (CONNECT)
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:48 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: timeout set to 10 seconds
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:48 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: send (AT&F^M)
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:48 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: expect (OK)
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:48 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: ^M
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:48 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: ^SRVST:2^M
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:48 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: AT&F^M^M
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:48 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: OK
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:48 2017 local2.info chat[12824]:  -- got it
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:48 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: send (ATE1^M)
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:48 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: expect (OK)
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:48 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: ^M
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:48 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: ATE1^M^M
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:48 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: OK
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:48 2017 local2.info chat[12824]:  -- got it
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:48 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: send (AT+CGDCONT=1,"IP","broadband"^M)
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:48 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: send (AT\^SYSCFG=2,2,3FFFFFFF,1,4^M)
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:49 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: timeout set to 30 seconds
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:49 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: expect (OK)
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:49 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: ^M
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:49 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: AT+CGDCONT=1,"IP","broadband"^M^M
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:49 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: OK
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:49 2017 local2.info chat[12824]:  -- got it
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:49 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: send (ATD*99***1#^M)
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:49 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: expect (CONNECT)
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:49 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: ^M
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:49 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: AT^SYSCFG=2,2,3FFFFFFF,1,4^M^M
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:49 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: OK^M
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:49 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: T^M
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:49 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: ^SRVST:1^M
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:49 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: ^M
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:49 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: ^SRVST:2^M
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:49 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: D*99***1#^M^M
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:49 2017 local2.info chat[12824]: NO CARRIER
    Sat Mar 25 16:51:49 2017 local2.info chat[12824]:  -- failed
    

    I'm going back to painting...
  • The Rustoleum paint is a lot easier to apply. The can has a lot more pressure and the spray is a lot finer. It takes longer to dry. I've been using sandpaper to check how dry the paint is. At this rate the 3rd coat will take place in 2 days and then it needs a week where I'll have to be careful with it.

    Since we have all that time to play with, I ordered an unlocked openwrt approved USB 3G modem. In the meantime, the Huawei E1815 does everything but connect. I can send it AT commands, even get the RSSI. It's funny that I'm doing this to get RSSI, and now I have RSSI, but no www.
  • Check with Diver Bob on his rotary encoders
    Jim
  • erco wrote: »
    Buck, actually my robots are swarming outside your house as we speak, recharging and computing a firing solution. Outer doors are open. Relax and have a brewski. One. Pabst. Only.

    Actually no they are not. I saw them board an MTA bus around 9PM yesterday.

    And why is there a big cloud of blue stuff parked over your place??!!
  • New motors, and gearboxes. I think these could work for a variety of applications. At $20 for the motor and gearbox, I'm wondering why they aren't popular on medium size bots. Here they are flanked by some diodes and caps. The new motors weigh in at the same current as the old ones.

    I put a heater in the garage and might be able to speed up the paint drying nonsense.

    @RS_Jim I will, thanks. I'm pretty sure I will be putting an IP67 pot on the steering arm pivot point, possibly one on each side. I will take the linear actuator apart and see if there is something I can do internally whilst keeping it "IP67", but I kinda doubt it.

    I have a mock version of it using a servo and a pot, which works great for playing with code. I haven't done much with this type of thing, I looked at some Arduino code and it looks simple enough for me to redo in SPIN, after I checkout OBEX.

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  • ercoerco Posts: 18,184
    How'd you get those motors? Power Wheels is Fisher Price, owned by Mattel. They don't sell replacements and we at Mattel couldn't get any either.

    Jealous!
    "When you make a thing, a thing that is new, it is so complicated making it that it is bound to be ugly. But those that make it after you, they don’t have to worry about making it. And they can make it pretty, and so everybody can like it when others make it after you."

    - Pablo Picasso
  • Amazon, $20 ea. I searched for the number on the motor. I guess I lucked out on that one! I just looked again and I can see what you mean. I guess that explains why they're not popular on robots.

    It's a nice cloudy day to endlessly stare at modem configurations. Anyone want to log in and fix it for me? I can get SSH and web GUI access to you. I know someone is dying to try... Somewhere... Maybe I can wait for the modem everyone else is using. I doubt it. Whatever is wrong with this has nothing to do with compatibility, else I doubt the AT commands would echo OK except for the connect command.

    Speaking of modems, I scored a used Huawei E-367U modem for $1 shipped!
  • I took the actuator apart to check for any potential issues and also see if there's a way to mount something to it for feedback. Plenty of grease, that is good. The motor brushes are horrible, but there's enough of them to last a long time.

    I'm pretty sure I will just put a pot on the steering.

    Here are some pics of the internals.
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  • erco wrote: »
    How'd you get those motors? Power Wheels is Fisher Price, owned by Mattel. They don't sell replacements and we at Mattel couldn't get any either.

    Jealous!

    They were there because I arranged it.

    Oh your robots should be arriving tomorrow having flown cargo. But they are leaving in three days to visit Oz...

  • I was unbricking the MR3020 this morning, for the 5th time, when it occurred to me that the Raspberry Pi would be a much better choice for this. I do have a compatible modem on the way, but the MR3020 was out of space for packages I wanted. At best I'd have an L2TP VPN on the MR3020, which isn't a huge deal since its IP will change upon connect, and only I will know the new IP.

    It took about 15 minutes to get the modem working on the Pi. I discovered that every single port is blocked, 1-65535, a so called "Private IP". I could do a reverse tunnel that doesn't need any incoming ports open, but I feel as though it will be problematic. So back on the phone with AT&T I found out that for $3/mo the modem can have a dynamic public IP, and ports higher than 12000 would be open. I like the idea of dynamic IP, I've been using dyndns for 10+ years with no issues there. Also, there is a one time $500 setup fee for a static IP.

    Another really cool thing is that I can add as many modems as I want. Since there is one in the mail, I could use that one on another rPi for redundancy. Or I can make another project out of it. They all share my current data plan, and the only thing I'm paying extra for is the $3/mo. I had no idea that putting robots on cell modems was this cheap and easy, MR3020 aside.

    Now the rover will have a real server onboard. I suppose it is a desktop as well. Speaking of which, I hope to be able to program the Propeller remotely by using VNC to access the Pi. That would remove the need for the USB over Ethernet device, which I still have time to return.

    WWAN > 3G Modem > rPi = USB + LAN

    At this point, it is safe to say the connectivity is definitely possible, and not resulting in huge monthly fees like I had always assumed.

    Here are some more pics. I have the steering actuator mounted. The measured steering travel is 2". The actuator says it's 2". Somehow, the actuator travel is longer than 2" and binds a little. I hope to move the limit switch in the actuator. If I can't I will modify the steering, I don't want any accidental binding or any extra current drain.

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  • After spending 4 hours at the AT&T store, I found out this is not going to happen. All of the info on this page is wrong. The people I spent 3 hours on the phone with yesterday sold me a big pile of misinformation. AT&T says if you want a public dynamic IP you need a custom APN. You have to have 4 lines minimum and you need some other thing that nobody was able to tell me how to get. Because of the confusion, I ended up walking out with more data, a lower cell phone bill and a $25 credit. That was nice of them. Good rover.

    So, reverse SSH tunnel it is!

    I'm not real happy about being forced into this, but I'm sure I can make it work. With reverse SSH, the rover is going to have to dial home and open up an SSH connection to a server here. With that tunnel open, I can connect on any port, protocol or IP on the rover's LAN. This is probably the only way you're going to get a robot on 3/4G, on a shared data plan. I'll be sure to post some details.

  • So I guess its ET Phone Home!
    Jim
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