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Sapieha
09-04-2007, 06:37 AM
Sorry my bad English but I have 2 Questions / Suggestion

Look pictures !!

More crazy suggestion’s to next generation “Propeller chip”

Ps.
It is customers that buy this chip so giv him good product.

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Sapieha

Post Edited (Sapieha) : 9/8/2007 11:10:11 PM GMT

Sapieha
09-04-2007, 07:25 AM
It is only one idea.

In Shift Reg's.jpg - Sys clok /X else PLL *X
It speech for it self (Versalite Serie Communikation)

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Sapieha

deSilva
09-04-2007, 09:42 AM
Sorry Sapieha, your questions are riddles....
Can you ask in some other language: The people here speak German, Dutch, Spanish and even more languages and can most likely translate.

Sapieha
09-04-2007, 10:02 AM
My lagage is Polisz and Swedish only

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Sapieha

Sapieha
09-04-2007, 11:34 AM
Hej. Mr. deSilva

Du har skrivit att jag kan skriva i en annan språk.

Problemet med Propeler Tools 1.05.5 visar sig på två ulika sät.

1.Programet hänger sig vid upstarten av nedladning till Propeler vid scaning av portar om jag koplar inte lås från dator D-Links BlueToouth plugen. Om plugen siter i serie ködjan innan Propelers USB Com number.

Vid dena alternativ finns inte D-Link inloplad till USB.
2. Om jag inte koplar Protp Board till USB wid start av Load RAM eller EEProm så vid
scaningen av serie portar hänger sig programet i scan port mode och sen gor EJ programet att brytas ens med Aktivitetshanteraren.


Ps. Har sporat problemet till avsaknad av Time out i Scan routiner till nedladnings programet.

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Sapieha

lrumler
09-04-2007, 02:33 PM
Sapela,

I don't read Swedish... so I put your text into an online translator. Here is the result:

hi Mr. design You have clerical error that self able write in an other language. Problem with Propeler Tools 1.05.5 am exposing themselves on two ulika sät. 1.Programet am hanging themselves wide upstarten of nedladning to Propeler wide scan of gate if self koplar nots lock from dator D - Limp BlueToouth tap. If tap siter in series ködjan entrance Propelers USB number. Wide dena alternative find nots D - Limp entrance to USB. 2. If self nots koplar Protege Board to USB wid take-off of Load FRAME ors EEProm so wide scaningen of series gate am hanging themselves program in scan gate vogue and late gor NOTS program that quarry alike with Aktivitetshanteraren. Ps. Had odd problem to want of Time out in Scan routiner to nedladnings program.

It is clear that you are having problems with the Propeller tool...it appears that you have isolated the problem and that you are suggesting an architectural change that Chip will certainly understand... It appears to me that you feel the recommended change would help with blue tooth communications.

Am I close?

Rich

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"Integrity without knowledge is weak and useless, and knowledge without integrity is dangerous and dreadful." -Samuel Johnson

Paul Baker
09-04-2007, 02:41 PM
Sapieha, we are aware there is an issue with BlueTooth modules and the Tool, we are working on a solution but do not have a satifiscatory means of dealing with it we are happy with. Can you disable your BlueTooth module, that should take care of the problem in the meantime.

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Paul Baker (mailto:pbaker@parallax.com)
Propeller Applications Engineer
[/url][url=http://www.parallax.com] (http://www.parallax.com)
Parallax, Inc. (http://www.parallax.com)

Henrik
09-04-2007, 02:45 PM
Sapieha said...
Hej. Mr. deSilva

Du har skrivit att jag kan skriva i en annan språk.

Problemet med Propeler Tools 1.05.5 visar sig på två ulika sät.

1.Programet hänger sig vid upstarten av nedladning till Propeler vid scaning av portar om jag koplar inte lås från dator D-Links BlueToouth plugen. Om plugen siter i serie ködjan innan Propelers USB Com number.

Vid dena alternativ finns inte D-Link inloplad till USB.
2. Om jag inte koplar Protp Board till USB wid start av Load RAM eller EEProm så vid
scaningen av serie portar hänger sig programet i scan port mode och sen gor EJ programet att brytas ens med Aktivitetshanteraren.


Ps. Har sporat problemet till avsaknad av Time out i Scan routiner till nedladnings programet.



Direct translation:

"Hi. Mr deSilva

You have written that I may write in a different language.

The problem with the Propeller tool 1.05.5 shows in two different ways.

1. The program hangs at start up of download to the Propeller at the scanning of the ports if I don't disconnect the D-link BlueTooth plugg. If the plugg is in the chain before the Propeller USB Com number.

In this case the D-link isn't connected to USB.
2. If I don't connect the Prop board to USB at start of Load RAM or EEProm , the program hangs when scanning in scan port mode and can not be stopped, not even with the task handler.

PS. Have traced the problem to lack of Time out in scan routin to the download program."

deSilva
09-04-2007, 03:12 PM
lrumler said...
... so I put your text into an online translator. Here is the result:


O dear! Back-changing the text to our common Germanic roots and adding the German vowel shifts gives a much clearer idea what he wants than this!!!
But I like the piece: "Mr. Design" http://forums.parallax.com/images/smilies/smile.gif

@Christoffer

What I now understand is that you made a suggestion to add a fast internally clocked SHIFT-IN and SHIFT-OUT logic

My personal opinion is this:
(a) You can easily use the Video Logic for "shift-out"
(b) "shift-in" is something many have already missed, for reading video signals or a fast serial protocol generated by another Propeller, or for just simplifying the code of slow seriel protocols. It will improve the serial SPIN drivers considerably!

Regarding machine code in the COG: As you have to use the input data somehow, which will take - say - 50 ticks on the current Propeller = 620 ns. Shifting-in 32 bits can be done by 20 ns/Bit = 50 MHz at most.
(c) Though it is not in the "spirit" of the Propeller to add "specific silicon" I should suport your request!

Post Edited (deSilva) : 9/4/2007 7:30:46 AM GMT

Sapieha
09-04-2007, 03:19 PM
Henrik Tack. för translation.

Thenks Paul.
Only solution I see is manually managing Com port setup in programet

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Sapieha

Mightor
09-04-2007, 03:34 PM
Translated using an automated tool, so don't laugh, please...

Wy nie jesteście pierwsza osoba pytać o ten (to). Z nadzieją *Parallax* będzie dodawać ten (to) *functionality* do następnej wersji *Propeller* Narzędzie (obrabiać).

Du är inte den första personen som ska frågas för denna. Hopefully tillfogar ska Parallax denna funktionsduglighet till den nästa versionen av propellern bearbetar.

"You are not the first person to ask for this. Hopefully Parallax will add this functionality to the next version of the Propeller Tool."

Gr,
Mightor

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| To know recursion, you must first know recursion.

Sapieha
09-04-2007, 03:44 PM
Mr. deSilva
Yes. It is my suggestion to add a fast internally clocked SHIFT-IN and SHIFT-OUT logic.
It is only one suggestion to very fast seriel comunikation Prop-Master to Prop-Slave and much more bat only if it have variation in length (4 to 32 bits in waitShift IN-OUT flag test)

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Sapieha

Sapieha
09-04-2007, 04:03 PM
Mr.deSilva You ... said...

Regarding machine code in the COG: As you have to use the input data somehow, which will take - say - 50 ticks on the current Propeller = 620 ns. Shifting-in 32 bits can be done by 20 ns/Bit = 50 MHz at most


Bat You mising PLL funktion in my suggestion (Sys Clock * X ) = (80MHz*X) On maybe 2 ticks on the current Propeller for Shifting-in 32 bits

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Sapieha

deSilva
09-04-2007, 04:45 PM
Please skip the "Mr." I am just "deSilva" http://forums.parallax.com/images/smilies/smile.gif

The problem is not the clock speed but the processing. Just shifting data in is - as the Americans say (do they?) - "pissing in the wind" http://forums.parallax.com/images/smilies/smile.gif In makes little sense to be much faster than the processing. A little bit faster is fine, as you have an asynchronious protocol here which needs synchronisation by other means (start bit = "attention bit", either on the same line or a different line), which can vary considerably...

Of course, the "word-length" of the signal is also very important and must be flexible; this is when the instruction stops, or - even better - it should be arranged in the same way as the Video Logic: Waiting only at the following SHIFTIN instruction.

deSilva
09-04-2007, 04:56 PM
Me said...
Waiting only at the following SHIFTIN instruction


Oh well, this is nasty. You have to know or course, when the SHIFTIN has completed to process the word.
Polling it is way to slow. (2 instructions!) And how? A new flag? Shudder! But blocking the instruction flow is no good either....

Ariba
09-04-2007, 05:22 PM
Sapieha

Look at this Thread:
http://forums.parallax.com/showthread.php?p=665055

in posting number 10, you can find a little tool, that solves your problem with the bluetooth device.

Andy

deSilva
09-04-2007, 05:25 PM
Ariba, how come you know all threads by heart??

Mightor
09-04-2007, 05:29 PM
deSilva said...
Ariba, how come you know all threads by heart??

I bet he secretly works for Google.

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| To know recursion, you must first know recursion.

Ariba
09-04-2007, 05:30 PM
No, Google was working for me...

ErNa
09-04-2007, 05:40 PM
To me, sunrise would be the implemetation of a channel mechanism like known from Occam and Transputers. This would be great and btw, it the transputer links survived in ad#s sharc, blackfin etc. This would open a way to numbercrunching. Just:

out channel# data

and then

in channel# data

a separate definition table defines the linking of the channels. and it will not make a difference, if the cogs are located in separated chips!

will the dark days twindle?

Sapieha
09-04-2007, 05:56 PM
Ariba Thanks.

However D-Link is not only problem.
If I start my "second" programs it is same problem but bluetooth device is not in computer.
However Com port is not blocked, if it is blocked by my "second program" Propeler tools funktions OK! and talking "Com port not accessible"

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Sapieha

Baggers
09-04-2007, 06:00 PM
Paul Baker (Parallax) said...
Sapieha, we are aware there is an issue with BlueTooth modules and the Tool, we are working on a solution but do not have a satifiscatory means of dealing with it we are happy with. Can you disable your BlueTooth module, that should take care of the problem in the meantime.


Paul, could you not have a Lock to Port Setting in PropTool, so people can just set the port once, and just lock it to that port, it's a sure fire way to·fix the bluetooth bug :) and I'm sure you'll agree, it's a quick and easy hack/fix.

Baggers

Sapieha
09-04-2007, 06:14 PM
deSilva Thanks.

It was only basically idea.
But have many capabilites.

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Sapieha

Sapieha
09-05-2007, 07:36 AM
Thanks Baggers.

It is my suggestion but I think BOTH Setings maybe.
One people want have AUTO and other manually.

I'm sure you'll agree !!

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Sapieha

Fred Hawkins
09-05-2007, 08:17 AM
deSilva said...
Ariba, how come you know all threads by heart??
Probably he bookmarks them to a folder named 'useful prop stuff'.

Paul Baker
09-06-2007, 06:12 AM
Hi Sepieha, Im still having a little difficulty with the language barrier, but when I was talking about disabling the bluetooth device I mean to go into Windows Control Panel, System Utility, Hardware Tab, Device manager. Find the Bluetooth device then right click and choose disable. This will make the bluetooth disapear to windows and should solve the problem. It's a hack, but it should work.

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Paul Baker (mailto:pbaker@parallax.com)
Propeller Applications Engineer
[/url][url=http://www.parallax.com] (http://www.parallax.com)
Parallax, Inc. (http://www.parallax.com)

Sapieha
09-06-2007, 06:44 AM
Hi Paul.

I plan to use bluetooth device in my construktion. I can disable it but dis is wrong way.

Only way I accept is one more option in Propeler Tool – RUN – Yow have now.
1. Compile Curent
2. Compile Top
3. Identify Hardware

Give me one option
4. Manual Port Seting

Thanks

Ps. Paul I can’t help language barrier. I have never teach English i school and Forum is my forst attempt to writing in English. Sorry

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Sapieha

Post Edited (Sapieha) : 9/5/2007 11:24:02 PM GMT

Paul Baker
09-06-2007, 07:27 AM
No, it's ok that your English isn't perfect, heck your English is a million times better than my Sweedish :)

We are familiar with the problems bluetooth devices have with the Propeller Tool. The amusing thing is that it use to work with bluetooth devices much better, but we had so many requests to support USB to Serial adapters that do not follow the standard protocol for registration, that when we made it so they would work, the bluetooth devices started causing problems. At some point we will have a solution to the problem, but the guy who does the coding for it has been so busy with other responsibilities he hasn't had much time to work with the Tool for a while now. But we will get to the problem.

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Paul Baker (mailto:pbaker@parallax.com)
Propeller Applications Engineer
[/url][url=http://www.parallax.com] (http://www.parallax.com)
Parallax, Inc. (http://www.parallax.com)

Post Edited (Paul Baker (Parallax)) : 9/5/2007 11:31:55 PM GMT

Sapieha
09-06-2007, 07:39 AM
Hi Paul

Thanks for replay.

I understand.
If I can manually set up Propeller Tool to ComPort I will have then I have no problem !!

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Sapieha

Ariba
09-06-2007, 07:54 AM
Sapieha

Have you tried out, the PropUp Tool (I have posted the link before in this Thread) ?
You can manually set 4 COM ports to 4 different Propellers. If you upload the code with this Tool, there will be no Search on the COM ports, it only uses the defined Port number.

Andy

Sapieha
09-06-2007, 08:14 AM
Hi Ariba

This tool is OK but will have control over Program, no program control my.
I will completely stop Auto search. I have other program’s in my computer whom still have problem with Auto serch.

Ps. In Sweden spoken we ”I living in free country and nothing have power over my”

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Sapieha

Post Edited (Sapieha) : 9/6/2007 12:22:33 AM GMT