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View Full Version : Chatter SOPA (again) and how it would affect Parallax



Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi)
12-30-2011, 07:54 AM
Here's a link to an essay on Tom's Hardware about SOPA (Stop Online Piracy Act) and how it would affect their website:


http://www.tomshardware.com/news/toms-hardware-sopa-Stop-Online-Piracy-Act-PROTECT-IP-Senate,14393.html

Everything they talk about there applies equally to Parallax and to this forum. If you haven't called your congressperson yet in opposition to SOPA, please do it ASAP! Here's a link you can use to get your representative's contact info:


https://writerep.house.gov/writerep/welcome.shtml

This is not a political issue; it's a matter of survival for the websites, like this one, that we depend upon.

-Phil

VIRAND
12-30-2011, 08:34 AM
Another application for my Binary Champernowne Constant work. All data content therein is predetermined and predictively synthesized and not copied but completely original.

Loopy Byteloose
12-30-2011, 10:40 AM
If it is not a political issue, why should I contact my Congressman? These days everything that is economics is politics and everything that is politics is economics.

Sorry, but I am a bit world weary about compelling causes.

Oldbitcollector (Jeff)
12-30-2011, 03:33 PM
When (not if) a bill like SOPA does finally pass, I forsee the fracturing of some of the Internet into smaller private networks.

Wish I had some serious money to invest in Google. They are ready for this.

OBC

ElectricAye
12-30-2011, 06:33 PM
... Here's a link you can use to get your representative's contact info:


https://writerep.house.gov/writerep/welcome.shtml

.....

Thanks for that link, Phil. I used it to convey my non-poltical views about this non-poltical SOPA thing to my non-political congressman. I always feel that, even if my emails don't count for anything, at least I know I tried.

Generally speaking I sense that there's something of a power grab going on "out there" with the internet. As another example, Facebooger and Google want to run all our internet traffic through their own little cattle chutes so they can monitor and profit over every thing we do. And other companies are scrambling to figure out how to set up some cattle chutes of their own. This entire "frictionless sharing" movement seems completely idiotic to me and it worries me that so many of my fellow human beings seem to think this is not a threat or is, even worse, a positive thing.

http://www.businessweek.com/technology/why-facebooks-frictionless-sharing-is-the-future-10032011.html

I think the funniest and perhaps most ironic thing about all of this sharing business is that your actual friends probably don't give that much of a damn about what you do. Companies are working hard to figure out how to keep your friends interested in you (or at least provide you with the perception that your friends actually care) so that you will keep sharing more and more information about yourself, which the companies will sell and/or manipulate for marketing, political targeting, opinion manufacturing, etc.

http://www.technologyreview.com/article/39321/?p1=MstRcnt

Why this social sharing thing has become an obsession totally baffles me. Maybe it's because Twitter and Facebooger are now acting as psychological substitutes for what prayer used to be for our species, back when the only "thing" we thought might be listening or watching us was The Tooth Fairy, Santa Claus or (insert personal caring cosmic entity here).

potatohead
12-30-2011, 07:06 PM
Why contact legislators?

(sidebar)

Everything is political. Why? Because those that get that determine how it all goes for those that don't. Speak or be spoken for. That's the short answer on why. Tech will not win out on this one. They have already played that game, and we know that absolutely nothing survives the "scratch that itch" plus "many eyeballs" reality out there. Now that is known, they are using it to make the case for expansive powers without due process. All check, no balance, just because they want to. Their case is seeing success BECAUSE of technology. They are framing this as a last ditch effort, no alternatives. Either we speak out about how wrong that is and call them on the merits of their case, or this will go down as stated and we won't like the product of that. Count on it.

In this case, voting was delayed due to people contacting legislators. They got a bad read. Here's the thing. The entities who will profit from this expansion of power; namely, the ability to censor the net without due process, won't quit asking. The amounts of money in play are simply too great. Others can cite the reasons.

Dollars are being spent, or invested if you will, to make more dollars at our expense. The only real check on that is our speech, which is fairly diluted today, due to the dollars.

This stuff doesn't take much time. A few percent at most. If we do it, we get some balance. If we don't, we won't, and it's all really that simple. Sadly, that now needs to be a recurring investment. Tell your friends. The precedent is clear. They just keep pressing, and when people waver, they get some advance and we lose. Go and look. It's all right there, and I could easily cite pages and pages of stuff we have to live with because they paid the dollars to make their case at our expense. This isn't changing in the US anytime soon.

I personally DO spend about 5 percent of my free time on these matters. They are important.

(end sidebar)

You might be wondering, "why now?"

The current composition of Congress is favorable to this kind of thing. There will be a big press early next year to revisit this matter, and it will be done under the radar, not seeing much, if any media attention. Big media stands to seriously benefit from this. The general public doesn't get this stuff any more than they did the last few ugly laws passed without serious debate. This one is no different.

They will do it as things ramp up for the election. It is a prime time, with this being the early dry run, with some chance of success. Now that they've seen the opposition, they will re-frame this stuff and present it again. Both speakers, House and Senate have expressed a desire to settle this quickly before the election gets into full swing.

Why is that?

Because it's the kind of thing that looks bad AFTER it's done, which is why it will be pressed hard and quietly early on, most likely attached to some must do legislation.

My best guess target is the two month extension on pay roll tax ending in Feb sometime. That bill will need to pass, and so will anything attached to it. It is vital we speak on this now, and when it comes to attention again. It will. This is exactly why key entities are continuing to press the issue. They know it was a first pass, and they know both houses are gearing up to move this one through. Not just put it on the table, but pass it. Congress is not well aligned with ordinary people right now.

Again, there is nothing worse. I hate this garbage. But, I hate the passing of it and dealing with it as law worse. So there you go, my personal motivations for you to consider.

Cluso99
12-30-2011, 07:19 PM
Google and the other big players would just host in another country. But for the little USA players it will be history!

I am in Oz and if it distracts from local politics here, our politicians will follow suit.

Just my 2c. (oooh, is that statement anyones trademark??)

potatohead
12-30-2011, 07:23 PM
I think it's worse than that. US will be asserting regulatory powers globally. I fully expect balkanization of the net along basic political lines, with the US losing it's trusted position for failure to live up to it's founding values when shepherding the net.

Peter KG6LSE
12-30-2011, 07:24 PM
I did my damage today .......... 24 Phone calls later to all the Body’s I can contact Is as good as I can do..



Peter...

ElectricAye
12-30-2011, 07:28 PM
...

Just my 2c. (oooh, is that statement anyones trademark??)

It probably belongs to Disney. If I were you, I wouldn't even think of sailing into US waters now. The claim can be made that you violated copyright from your sailing vessel, therefore it will be confiscated as an accessory to your crime. Shame on you.

Kevin Wood
12-30-2011, 09:10 PM
> with the US losing it's trusted position for failure to live up to it's founding values

Don't worry... we're doing that just fine without SOPA...

doggiedoc
12-31-2011, 01:17 PM
I have chimed in with a message to my congressman:


Dear Congressman Mulvaney,

I am writing you to express my concerns over “Stop Online Piracy Act” (SOPA) legislation. While I certainly oppose piracy, the information that I am reading online about SOPA such as http://www.tomshardware.com/news/toms-hardware-sopa-Stop-Online-Piracy-Act-PROTECT-IP-Senate,14393.html has me worried that such legislation will overbearing and directly affect sites that I depend on and use daily.

I am interested to know your position on this particular matter.

Thank you,
Paul A. Willoughby, DVM
Tega Cay Animal Hospital


Now to find my Senators email....

Doc

doggiedoc
12-31-2011, 01:19 PM
Link for finding your Senators:

http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_information/senators_cfm.cfm

Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi)
12-31-2011, 05:14 PM
Thanks for that link, Paul!

When contacting your senators, be sure to refer to the senate version of the legislation, which is the "Protect IP Act." There will be differences between the two versions, since they were written more or less independently, and I do not know which of the two is the more onerous. Although internet attention seems to be focused on SOPA, it certainly doesn't hurt to cover all the bases.

-Phil

lanternfish
12-31-2011, 09:46 PM
We already have similar legislation here in NZ. And it doesn't appear to have made any difference to the root problem, downloading of copyright music and video.

frank freedman
01-02-2012, 06:02 AM
We already have similar legislation here in NZ. And it doesn't appear to have made any difference to the root problem, downloading of copyright music and video.

And why would it? For every way someone would find to protect something, a hell of a lot more are out trying to unprotect it. Most of these types of law are not about anti-piracy, but more about giving some politician/party advantage over another. It they were serious about anti-piracy, they would simply use the existing law more effectively against individuals and entities within their legal jurisdiction and use sanctions and other methods to control those who are outside their lawful reach.

I would be willing that there are things which could be done against China such that their government would become suddenly much more cooperative regarding pirates, but sadly some of our business leaders (i.e. GE, apple and others) and politicians (who's left to borrow from for pet projects/social experimentation) have no such interest in pressuring one of the biggest co-conspirators in global piracy. Until we in the US, and other countries grow a pair and become less dependent on countries like China, the piracy outside of US law will continue unchecked, and until people here trading in copyrighted and other IP material realize that doing so is the equivalent of walking out of the store without paying, it won't stop here either.......

Frank

lanternfish
01-02-2012, 08:31 AM
@ frank freedman: Good points. And too many politicians are rarely tech literate enough to understand the full implications of what they are voting for (or against) let alone what the issues are. And they was clearly evident in NZ with the parliamentary 'debates' where so many of those on both sides of the debate showed their ignorance with poorly constructed references to the internet/web when they just meant 'computer' and vice versa.

PJ Allen
01-02-2012, 02:27 PM
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-16367042

ElectricAye
01-02-2012, 05:37 PM
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-16367042


Instead of expensive sitting-duck satellite stuff, why not start with something down to earth and less centralized? Perhaps laser systems can't leap over oceans, but I would think it would be harder for centralized authorities to shut them all down simultaneously.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RONJA

http://forums.parallax.com/showthread.php?113361-High-Speed-optical-transmissions-thru-air&p=812537&viewfull=1#post812537

sam_sam_sam
01-04-2012, 01:48 AM
Thanks for that link, Paul!

When contacting your senators, be sure to refer to the senate version of the legislation, which is the "Protect IP Act." There will be differences between the two versions, since they were written more or less independently, and I do not know which of the two is the more onerous. Although internet attention seems to be focused on SOPA, it certainly doesn't hurt to cover all the bases.

-Phil


I wrote my senators about how I feel about this topic while Online Piracy is a real problem
I DO NOT think that the way this bill is written that it will help very much in the long run
I think it will do more harm

nightwing
01-04-2012, 03:41 AM
I have a saying. Locks only keep honest people out.

This does nothing to stop the problem.

Oh saw this....

http://kotaku.com/5872766/the-video-game-industrys-lobbyists-support-sopa-but-they-understand-why-you-might-not

Tor
01-04-2012, 01:18 PM
I have a saying. Locks only keep honest people out.
Locks also keep drunk people out.. as I had to learn way back when I was a teenager and had to throw a drunk guy out of the house - he had just wandered in. We didn't lock doors back then. After the second time we learned to start locking the doors. Sigh.

-Tor

doggiedoc
01-06-2012, 05:48 PM
Response from my congressman.




Dear Dr. Willoughby,

Thank you for contacting me with your concerns about the Stop Online Piracy Act. I appreciate you taking the time to share your thoughts with me.

As you may know, H.R. 3261 the Stop Online Piracy Act was recently introduced by Rep. Lamar Smith, where it was referred to the House Committee on the Judiciary. Companion legislation in the Senate, S. 968, the Preventing Real Online Threats to Economic Creativity and Theft of Intellectual Property Act of 2011 (PROTECT-IP) was introduced by Senator Patrick Leahy and is currently pending in the Senate. Both bills would give the federal government expanded authority to pursue websites which are accused of providing pirated or counterfeit content.

Individuals have expressed concerns that these bills may lead to excessive government regulation of internet speech. For this reason, concerns have been raised about the impact this may have on user uploaded websites such as YouTube and Facebook. These are legitimate concerns, and I look forward to reviewing the Judiciary Committee's report on this issue. Please know, should this legislation arrive on the House floor, I will keep your concerns about it in mind.

Thank you again for contacting me about this important issue, and please do not hesitate to let me know if I may be of additional assistance in the future. It is a privilege to serve you.

Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi)
01-06-2012, 06:20 PM
"I'll keep that in mind," is how I always respond to a suggestion that I plan to ignore.

-Phil

doggiedoc
01-06-2012, 07:40 PM
"I'll keep that in mind," is how I always respond to a suggestion that I plan to ignore.

-PhilI drew the same conclusion.

Ken Gracey
01-06-2012, 08:00 PM
"I'll keep that in mind," is how I always respond to a suggestion that I plan to ignore.

-Phil

You shouldn't have told me, Phil! I just did a search of all of my deleted items and came up with about a dozen from you that included this phrase!

Ken Gracey

Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi)
01-06-2012, 08:34 PM
Ouch! So busted! -P.

potatohead
01-07-2012, 07:39 PM
This one isn't going away folks.

It is as I suspected earlier. SOPA targeted for early votes: http://www.searchenginejournal.com/tech-giants-support-open-act/38534/

Reid: “This is a bipartisan piece of legislation which is extremely important. I repeat, it is bipartisan. I hope we can have a productive couple of days, pass this bill, and move on to other matters.”

ASNE issues letter against: http://asne.org/Article_View/ArticleId/2107/ASNE-Issues-Letter-Opposing-Onerous-Federal-Anti-Piracy-Bill.aspx

ASNE: "
ASNE's letter makes it clear that the organization strongly opposes content piracy and supports the committee's efforts to eradicate it. But SOPA in its present form "allows individual copyright owners to effect the most onerous restriction on speech -- the prior restraint -- with little evidence and virtually no due process, utilizing vague and overbroad definitions in the process," says the letter, signed by ASNE President Ken Paulson.
"Navigating the balance between copyright and free speech demands precision, and in seeking to protect the interests of copyright holders, the First Amendment requires Congress to adopt the least restrictive intrusion on speech available," ASNE tells the committee. "SOPA fails this test.""

The list of supporters isn't trivial: http://www.opencongress.org/bill/112-s968/money

You will find a list of dollars and people on that page. Senator Reid, who is driving this to a quick vote saw: $665,420 fall his way for moving it forward. (read, passage)

One other thing not reported right now is the heavy hitters backing the legislation have convinced small scale creators that they stand to gain significantly from the legislation, forming a pool of very aggressive advocates who also happen to have excellent communications skills. Their motive is dollars, but a secondary one is just getting the power for themselves, frequently mentioning they would employ this legislation in aggressive ways to combat ALL uses of their works to drive revenue, with fair uses not even under discussion.

There is some significant overlap between technical people against and for, complicating things somewhat as well.

Right now, I would peg this for passage. No joke.

The US is pressing on Spain to also implement a similar law: http://torrentfreak.com/us-threatened-to-blacklist-spain-for-not-implementing-site-blocking-law-120105/

When we see that, know the majority view is passage, and that it's been framed as an economic necessity, given hard times. That's standard shock doctrine type policy, which generally isn't very good for ordinary people.

Ironically, smaller scale creators may not benefit much at all, as the bar for competitive works and liabilities surrounding those will be much higher under SOPA, which will generally have a chilling effect on small scale works overall, encouraging more middle man publishing where the liabilities can be paid for, and less direct trade between creator and audience / consumer.

http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20111219/04322417127/reuters-media-columnist-explains-that-sopapipa-are-cure-worse-than-disease.shtml

Doesn't look good kids.

Dave Hein
01-07-2012, 08:51 PM
I've done some research on SOPA, and I agree with some of the reasons for the bill, but I understand the concerns about is as well. However, discussing political issues such as this is forbidden on this forum, and it should be moved to some other forum.



Political or religious beliefs:
The Parallax Discussion Forums is not the venue to discuss religious/non-religious agendas, nor is it a place for political rants or arguments. As stated above: the forums were created to promote and allow ongoing discussions about, but not limited to, products designed and developed by Parallax Inc. If you wish to discuss the existence of things divine or the most recent upheaval in the legislature of man, find another forum.

Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi)
01-07-2012, 09:14 PM
However, discussing political issues such as this is forbidden on this forum, and it should be moved to some other forum.
Dave, I respectfully disagree. If you read the Tom's Hardware essay linked to in my first post, you would understand that this is something that touches on the very essence and existence of forums like this one. I stated from the outset that it's not a political matter and, in the sense of left versus right, it is not. It is, however, a brewing legal issue that has the potential to impact the internet and this very forum in a negative way. As such, I can't think of a better place than here, in the very venue that it threatens, to discuss SOPA and advocate either for amending it or voting it down.

-Phil

ctwardell
01-07-2012, 09:40 PM
I agree with Phil that SOPA is a subject of importance to the forum.

C.W.

Dave Hein
01-07-2012, 09:47 PM
Phil, I had read Tom's Hardware essay. I have also read the text of HR 3261. Have you read it? Tom is clearly putting his own spin on the topic, as are many of the bloggers who oppose the bill. I'm assuming you read the bill. Can you cite specific text that you object to?

Legal issues are political issues. Who do you think passes the laws? As far as venues for discussing this bill, I would think that there are more appropriate places than the Parallax forum.

Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi)
01-07-2012, 10:28 PM
Legal issues are political issues.
Nonsense. We discuss legal issues here all the time without invoking partisan politics. For example, FCC rules and regulations come up quite frequently, as do matters of patent law.


As far as venues for discussing this bill, I would think that there are more appropriate places than the Parallax forum.
I guess we can agree to disagree about that. The ultimate decision could be made by the moderators; and I will respect whatever action, if any, that they choose to take. (Browser has recused himself, due to a conflict of interest. :) )

-Phil

Peter KG6LSE
01-07-2012, 10:39 PM
I would assume if a Admin or a Company owner( Ken Gracy ) allready posted in Here ,that the thread is OK .

:)

That said I got back a letter Form my Rep.. . some what generic but I have had a few convos with him in the past ..
so he knows Of me .. for better or worse ..

tomorrow Ill hit the phones again ..
As a content producer ( photographer ) and a consumer ( human ) I know what is at steak here .
DCMA is enough ! .. the simple fact is . the crimes are not being delt with in the right way ...

I have seen my stuff on a few sites I wish I had a easy way to deal with them .. with this law I can make a phone call and all of you tube can be shut down ......

this is not right .. ..

no one person sould have this controll .. its not gonna work ...


Peter...

Dave Hein
01-07-2012, 10:41 PM
The forum guidelines don't mention "partisan politics". The do forbid discussions on ";the most recent upheaval in the legislature". It seems like SOPA fits this description. If the moderators allow bending the rules on this topic, then why have rules at all?

BTW, you seem to have ignored my main question. Can you cite specific text in HR 3261 that you object to?

Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi)
01-07-2012, 11:26 PM
Can you cite specific text in HR 3261 that you object to?
Sect. 102.c.2 provides that DNS providers and search engines must, when so ordered, make it impossible to link to sites deemed infringing. This represents a legal hijacking and possible fragmentation of the Domain Name System, and places an undue burden on the likes of Google and other search engine providers.

Sect. 102.c.4.A.ii provides penalties for those who offer circumvention means, such as the Firefox add-on (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MAFIAAFire_Redirector) that bypasses DNS. That's overreaching, IMO.

BTW, this bill enjoys such bipartisan consensus and support that it can hardly be characterized as an "upheaval in the legislature", which I take to mean partisan bickering: IOW things that could divide the forum community along partisan lines.

-Phil

Dave Hein
01-08-2012, 12:10 AM
Excellent, now that you read the bill and cited sections that impact our freedom you shouild alert your U.S. representative to this. I agree with you on the two issues you cited. I think many of the aspects of this bill concerning piracy, infringement and fraud are important, and it would be good if the bill focuses specifically on those issues.

Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi)
01-08-2012, 12:41 AM
... you should alert your U.S. representative to this. I agree with you on the two issues you cited.
'Already did that last week ... and I'm glad to see that we agree on something. :)

-Phil

frank freedman
01-08-2012, 01:38 AM
I've done some research on SOPA, and I agree with some of the reasons for the bill, but I understand the concerns about is as well. However, discussing political issues such as this is forbidden on this forum, and it should be moved to some other forum.

Given the discussion has been about the effects of such a thing being put into place, no real mention of whether the proponents or opponents have an R or D in front of their names, it may still be political. But if you think about it, all things are political; all laws, all regulations come from politicians. Period. And every action or inaction has both overt and covert consequences.

It is not only proper to discuss these things in this forum, but is as essential as discussing the aspects of design and implementation of our products or writings. The arguments (that I have anyway) are that the bill is a feel good to the masses, and a means of control and restrictions imposed by a few "special" people who will attempt to control the content of the internet with little or no oversight or recourse to those who don't have a big bankroll. It also will IMO, cause a dampening of the sharing of much knowledge.

The worst part seems that I could as say a competitor cause someones internet business to be essentially shut down without cause on a whim without having to worry about something like due process get in the way of causing my competitor severe and unrecoverable damage while they fight the shutdown and try to prove that they should have been allowed to operate all along.

So, no we should not get into stupid pissing contests about the merits or faults of having an R/D in a politicians title as that is for other forums, but we better pay attention to the political machinations that directly affect our abilities to conduct business, share knowledge and opinions, and trade ideas without fear of unreasonable laws generated by politicians who pass them either out of malice or ignorance of the real issues underlying their "good intentions". Remember, the staffers are the ones doing the real writing, while the lobbyists (and the interests they represent) get the politicians ear.

Frank

frank freedman
01-08-2012, 02:21 AM
Excellent, now that you read the bill and cited sections that impact our freedom you shouild alert your U.S. representative to this. I agree with you on the two issues you cited. I think many of the aspects of this bill concerning piracy, infringement and fraud are important, and it would be good if the bill focuses specifically on those issues.

Yes, some of the ideas are important, but why the additional over-reach? We don't now enforce current law.

Frank

ctwardell
01-08-2012, 01:04 PM
The worst part seems that I could as say a competitor cause someones internet business to be essentially shut down without cause on a whim without having to worry about something like due process get in the way of causing my competitor severe and unrecoverable damage while they fight the shutdown and try to prove that they should have been allowed to operate all along.

That seems to be one of the worst aspects of SOPA. Some of the solutions that I provide for clients are web based design tools for their products and services. Within a given industry most of the companies sooner or later end up with similar tools, If all one needs to do is claim plausible copyright infringment it will turn into a war of trying to keep each others sites shut down. Think for a minute how messed up that is. Look at all the effort it takes to get a patent, yet it only gives you the right to sue, the heavy hand of government does not step in and shut the other guy down for possible infringement. In the case of SOPA they need only CLAIM copyright infringement and the heavy hand of govenment can step in WITHOUT DUE PROCESS and block your DNS entries.

C.W.

Oldbitcollector (Jeff)
01-08-2012, 11:26 PM
[devil himself]

I think my next business move will be to establish an alternate DNS or better yet a plug-in which will gain popularity by bypassing those awful DNS blocks imposed by SOPA. Granted, I won't make money in phase one, but as soon as i have thousands of people trusting my "services", I can implement phase two where I create DNS redirects/login pages for large banks, gmail, and paypal. Woo Hoo!

[/devil himself]

This likely scenario scares me to death.. I can see many of my PC customers getting sucked into this trap.

OBC

Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi)
01-14-2012, 03:54 AM
Some victories of sorts:


http://news.cnet.com/8301-31001_3-57358947-261/dns-provision-pulled-from-sopa-victory-for-opponents/
http://news.cnet.com/8301-31921_3-57358374-281/sen-leahy-bows-to-pressure-pledges-to-amend-protect-ip-bill/?tag=mncol;txt

Thanks to everyone who contacted their representatives in Congress!

It's not over, by a long shot; but it's clear that constituents still have a say.

-Phil

davejames
01-14-2012, 04:47 AM
Here's what one of "my" (aak!) Senators had to say:

Dear Mr. James:

I received your letter expressing opposition to the "Preventing Real Online Threats to Economic Creativity and Theft of Intellectual Property Act," commonly known as the "PROTECT IP Act." I appreciate knowing your views on this matter.

The "PROTECT IP Act" (S. 968) gives both copyright and trademark owners and the U.S. Department of Justice the authority to take action against websites that are "dedicated to infringing activities." These are websites that have "no significant use other than engaging in, enabling, or facilitating" copyright infringement, the sale of goods with a counterfeit trademark, or the evasion of technological measures designed to protect against copying.

The bill does not violate First Amendment rights to free speech because copyright piracy is not speech.

America's copyright industry is an important economic engine, and I believe copyright owners should be able to prevent their works from being illegally duplicated and stolen. The protection of intellectual property is particularly vital to California's thriving film, music, and high-technology industries.

I understand you have concerns about the "PROTECT IP Act." While I voted in favor of this bill when it was before the Senate Judiciary Committee, I have also been working with California high-technology businesses to improve the bill and to address the concerns of high-tech businesses, public interest groups and others. I recognize the bill needs further changes to prevent it from imposing undue burdens on legitimate businesses and activities, and I will be working to make the improvements, either by working with Senate Judiciary Committee Chairman Patrick Leahy (D-VT) or through amendments on the Senate floor.

On May 26, 2011, the Senate Judiciary Committee passed the "PROTECT IP Act" for consideration by the full Senate. Please know I will keep your concerns and thoughts in mind should the Senate proceed to a vote on this legislation. As you may be aware, Representative Lamar Smith (R-TX) has introduced similar legislation, the "Stop Online Piracy Act" (H.R. 3261), in the House of Representatives.

Once again, thank you for sharing your views. I hope you will continue to keep me informed on issues of importance to you. If you have any additional questions or concerns, please do not hesitate to contact my Washington, D.C. office at (202) 224-3841.

Wishing you a happy 2012.

Sincerely yours,

Dianne Feinstein
United States Senator

ElectricAye
01-14-2012, 05:14 AM
Here's what one of "my" (aak!) Senators had to say:...

Hey, at least you guys get some kind of response. I got diddly. I think my congressman comes from the Rupert Murdoch school of "If we want your opinion, we'll give it to you."

Jorge P
01-14-2012, 10:03 AM
Some news on this 11 hours ago http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/2012/01/under-voter-pressure-members-of-congress-backpedal-on-sopa.ars

ElectricAye
01-15-2012, 01:26 AM
The Whitehouse has this to say:

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/15/us/white-house-says-it-opposes-parts-of-2-antipiracy-bills.html?_r=1&hp

oldPGMguy
01-15-2012, 07:35 AM
Parallax should worry about going out of business....propeller is only thing going for them...as for SOPA its a sure bill to pass...no more free software kiddies

Peter KG6LSE
01-15-2012, 03:04 PM
Parallax should worry about going out of business....propeller is only thing going for them...as for SOPA its a sure bill to pass...no more free software kiddies

All the SPIN code in the OBEX is as open source as one can get . ( MIT )

unless you some how Broke the MIT license . I dont see how any one would have a legal Ground to stop parallax ..

In effect the code is public domain ..





Peter...

Heater.
01-15-2012, 05:15 PM
oldPGMguy, that is one big bad post you have made.


Parallax should worry about going out of business...
Is there something you know that we don't? As far as I know Parallax is in good business shape and I expect them to be around for a long time to come.



...propeller is only thing going for them...


Clearly not true.



...as for SOPA its a sure bill to pass...

Perhaps, and like the war or drugs or terror it will be equally ineffective. In deed similarly it will have a negative effect on the well being of society.



...no more free software kiddies


What on earth do you mean? Most of the software I use is licensed under the GPL or similar licenses. It's open source, it's free. Such licenses rely on copyright law to remain as free as they would like to be. I can't for the life of me see how SOPA changes any of that.

And by the way, who are you calling "kiddies".

Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi)
01-15-2012, 10:42 PM
Interesting SOPA/PIPA discussion on MSNBC between an NBC veep/legal counsel and a Reddit cofounder:


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/46004493#46004493

-Phil

Oldbitcollector (Jeff)
01-15-2012, 11:38 PM
And by the way, who are you calling "kiddies".

@Heater: I suspect we are being trolled...

Peter KG6LSE
01-15-2012, 11:54 PM
I dare YAHOO GOOGLE AND the rest to shut down for a day ..
I want to see every fat cat in Wash DC squirm when Gmail . Youtube and the rest are not acessable ..

I am quite mellow on most politics . but this is one I have no mercy for ......

if google did switch off for a day it would make the Biz stop in many places ... but it would Prove a huge point that the US Cant afford to pass this junk //

its going to cost the US a Huge part of its encon.

the Last thing WE need is a Upset in out Econ right now...


I wonder what would happen if every Biz tomarrow would unplug there servers .... how much hell it would rase .. From banks to google . Ohhh my Dr Evil side is pondering this one al night long..

I say have a national refuse to Boot day ..




Peter..

Heater.
01-16-2012, 12:30 AM
@Heater: I suspect we are being trolled...

Bah, I fall for it every time.

This whole copyright thing has had me hoping mad for ages. Music biz puts out music, radio stations have to pay to play it, if I ride in a taxi now I have to pay for hearing it on the radio in the taxi. If I buy a CD or such I have to pay just in case I am copying that music onto the CD. And so on. And I don't even want to hear 99% of what I am hearing.

Meanwhile, there is a huge pile of recorded material from years back that I would like to hear and would pay for a decent vinyl disc or even CD. But it's not available from the publishers.

All this stuff is rotting in vaults somewhere, due to copyright it's totally unavailable pretty much for ever.

Similarly, how do I get to see some of those thousands of brilliant old black and white movies?

Dave Hein
01-16-2012, 01:12 AM
Smith Drops Controversial SOPA Provision
http://radio.woai.com/cc-common/mainheadlines3.html?feed=119078&article=9616133

Did I mention that Lamar Smith is my U.S. Representative? Through the weird art of Gerrymandering, the area I live in, which is West of Austin, Tx, is in the same congressional district as Northern San Antonio, which is 80 miles to the south. Rather than write directly to Lamar Smith I decided to contact Joe Pags, who is a San Antonio radio personality that talks to Lamar Smith on his radio show every Wednesday. I sent him an email last Tuesday, and he responded with the single-word response -- "sure".



From: Pagliarulo, Joseph
Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 1:40
To: Dave Hein
Subject: RE: SOPA

sure

From: Dave Hein
Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 8:29 AM
To: Pagliarulo, Joseph
Subject: SOPA

Joe,

I am in general agreement with the SOPA bill, but the following section in the bill concerns me

Section 102.c.2.A.i A service provider shall take technically feasible and reasonable measures designed to prevent access by its subscribers located within the United States to the foreign infringing site (or portion thereof) that is subject to the order

This requires that Internet providers block access to foreign sites that the Attorney General believes are involved in piracy, patent infringement or some other illegal activity covered by the bill. I believe this has a significant impact on our freedom, and gives the U.S. government the power to apply censorship without due process.

The next time you talk to Lamar Smith, could you ask him why this section is necessary, and whether it could be removed from the bill?

Thanks,
Dave

On Wednesday, January 11, he talked to Lamar Smith, and at the end of their discussion he told him that several listeners are concerned about SOPA, and that it gives the Attorney General too much power to block foreign web sites. Lamar Smith's response was that a court case would need to be decided before a foreign web site could be blocked, and the Attorney General could not act on it alone.

Now, less than a week later, the DNS blocking provision has been removed. Coincedence? I don't think so. :) Actually, the change probably was a result of the White House speaking out against the DNS blocking provision.

Peter KG6LSE
01-16-2012, 01:16 AM
Similarly, how do I get to see some of those thousands of brilliant old black and white movies?

citizen Kane .......... Rosebud.....................