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nonnno
10-31-2010, 12:55 PM
Hi
I do not understand English.
I am connected to the propeller tip back and forth two or more
Want a common data exchange.
Signal for data connections and interactions, those raised on the agenda before available?
Yours sincerely

kyoji

RS_Jim
10-31-2010, 03:32 PM
Post your language preference, maybe a forum member can help in your native language.
Welcome to the forum.

nonnno
11-01-2010, 02:09 AM
Hi
私は日本人です。
日本語と英語は構造が大きく違うので翻訳が上手くできません。
日本語で連絡するBBSの設定が見つかりません、それはどの様な方法ですか?

私は複数の「Propeller」を接続して、データ資源を共通にアクセスする方法を探してい ます。
データはI2CやPSI等や並列のEEPROMやSRAMです。
どのMPUがデータ制御をするかMPU間でハンドシェイクのような方法で決めたいと思います。

「Propeller」の持つ8bitx4portのうち1portまたは2portを専用に 用い、
残りを外部への制御やデータに使用したいです。

実際にはどの様な方法でハンドシェイクやアビトレーションすればよいですか?
また、共通データ資源にアクセスするbit、portの巾は他によいアイデアがありますか。

外部にはアドレスやデータラッチを設置する用意があります。

敬具
kyoji

Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL)
11-01-2010, 02:42 AM
I think he would like to do Propeller to propeller communications. I'll try to find the post that Beau did .

Peter Jakacki
11-01-2010, 02:44 AM
nonno, are you trying to connect multiple Propellers chips together? What you are asking is not Propeller specific, the problems are common to any system. Arbitration in software is possible but slow and hardware would benefit from a gate array due to the large number of address/data/control signals from each CPU.

BTW, I2C if fully implemented allows for multi-master in it's protocol, just read the I2C specifications.

I do not think that the Propeller the best chip for this project. Have you had a look at the XMOS? (for instance)


I'm Japanese.
Japanese and English translation is not well structured, so very different.
Contact BBS found in the Japanese setting, is it any different way?

I have several "Propeller" connection, we are looking for a way to access shared data resources.
Data such as I2C and parallel EEPROM and the PSI and SRAM.
How do you control MPU MPU data in ways that would decide between handshakes.

"Propeller" with the 8bitx4port 1port of 2port or used only a
I want to use the data to the external control and the rest.

What do I really arbitration in such a way handshake or what?
In addition, access to common data resources bit, port width is there any other good ideas.

To be prepared to install an external address and data latches.

Yours sincerely
kyoji

wjsteele
11-01-2010, 02:47 AM
ここを見てください。

http://obex.parallax.com/objects/category/5/

Bill

Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL)
11-01-2010, 03:03 AM
Propeller DEMO : (14.5 Meg Baud) High Speed Prop-to-Prop Serial Communication

http://forums.parallax.com/showthread.php?p=694610

http://forums.parallax.com/showthread.php?t=99222

Peter Jakacki
11-01-2010, 03:25 AM
Hey guys, I think the OP is wanting to hookup shared "address and data buses" as he is mentioning parallel EEPROM and SRAM. The high-speed serial will do the job of transferring information between Props but I don't think he is looking for this simple type of implementation.

Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL)
11-01-2010, 03:42 AM
@ Peter you are correct.

Here is the translation via Google:

Quote:
Originally Posted by nonnno

I'm Japanese.

Japanese and English translation is not well structured, so very different. Contact BBS found in the Japanese setting, is it any different way?

I have several "Propeller" connection, we are looking for a way to access shared data resources.

Data such as I2C and parallel EEPROM and the PSI and SRAM.

How do you control MPU MPU data in ways that would decide between handshakes.

"Propeller" with the 8 bit x 4 port 1 port of 2 port or used only a

I want to use the data to the external control and the rest.

What do I really arbitration in such a way handshake or what?

In addition, access to common data resources bit, port width is there any other good ideas.

To be prepared to install an external address and data latches.

Yours sincerely

kyoji

jazzed
11-01-2010, 04:17 AM
Look at this thread: http://forums.parallax.com/showthread.php?t=115925

Up to 5MB/s Propeller HUB to HUB memory data transfers with single COG.
It is single master with up to 254 connected Propellers. No arbitration.
Uses chained boot for hello protocol node assignment. IPC is possible of course.
Chained boot is easier for development but slower to boot.
Parallel boot is possible with separate EEPROMs and different node assignment method.

I've been thinking about using a similar bus implementation for another design all day today although on a smaller scale.

nonnno
11-01-2010, 06:04 AM
私は25年くらい前、リレー制御盤の設計をしていました。
ある時伸線機を設計をしました。
それは3種類の部分で出来ています、
スタート部分、中間部分、終了部分。
中間部分は目的に応じて複数接続します。
それぞれは直列に接続されていて、どの部分からでも起動と停止が出来ます。
それらは相互に隣りに連絡した1本の線からの信号で決められた順序に従い、順次起動して行き順次停止をしま す。

私は今度の装置を同じ様なイメージで考えました。
隣りに手渡す1本か2本の調停信号線、
それぞれが持つI2C記憶装置(遅い)か、
並列記憶装置(多くのポートを消費する)、
そのどれにするかは未だ決めていません。

外部に操作する機能が少ないなら、並列記憶は快適な速度を得ることが出来ます。
外部の信号を多くしたいなら直列記憶を用いますが直列RAM素子は入手しにくいので
そのための別な並列~直列変換が必要です。

私は1プロセッサが付いた基板を横に並べるか、積み重ねることで任意のプロセッサ群を形成して 、
記憶装置を共有できるようにしたいです。
敬具
kyoji

nonnno
11-01-2010, 06:07 AM
ここを見てください。

http://obex.parallax.com/objects/category/5/

bill

私は英語の内容判断に時間がかかります。
私は此処を何度も探しました、

しかし直感的に内容を判断できないため、
未だ見つけられないでいます。

nonnno
11-01-2010, 06:16 AM
look at this thread: http://forums.parallax.com/showthread.php?t=115925


有り難う。
プロセッサの相互連絡は同じ感じです。
この方式では記憶装置はどの様にしますか?

Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL)
11-01-2010, 09:00 AM
Double post deleted.

Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL)
11-01-2010, 09:02 AM
I was 25 years ago, was designed to relay control panel.
Wire drawing machine designed for a certain time.
It is made up of three parts,
Start part, middle part, the end part.
Middle part is connected to several different purposes.
They are each connected in series, can start and stop at any part.
They are in the order determined by the signal from one line to next to each other, you gradually stop going to start the sequence.

I thought a similar image to the next unit.
Arbitration lines give the next one or two,
I2C each with a storage device (slow) or
Parallel storage (which consume a lot of ports)
Do any of you have not decided yet.

If the ability to operate outside a small, parallel memory speeds can be achieved comfortably.
The series uses a lot of memory if you want to signal an external serial RAM device is difficult to obtain because
- Another parallel conversion is required for that series.

How do I arrange for a processor with a horizontal board, formed by stacking a set of any processor,
I want to be able to share storage.
Yours sincerely
kyoji

Today, 06:07 AM
nonnno
Junior Member

Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 23
Re: Please help find the agenda.
Quote:
Originally Posted by wjsteele
Please see here.

http://obex.parallax.com/objects/category/5/

bill
I will take some time to determine the contents of the English.
終Waremasen actually read.

Today, 06:16 AM
nonnno
Junior Member

Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 23
Re: Please help find the agenda.
sing a similar bus implementation for another design all day today although on a smaller scale. [/ QUOTE]

Carry.
The processor is the same feeling to each other.
In this scheme the storage or charged?

nonnno
11-01-2010, 11:02 AM
i do not think that the propeller the best chip for this project. Have you had a look at the xmos? (for instance)

有り難う。
私は xmos を理解できませんでした。

nonnno
11-01-2010, 11:11 AM
”Carry.
The processor is the same feeling to each other.
In this scheme the storage or charged?”

有り難う、
この言葉が私のヒントになりそうに思います。

google翻訳は混乱しています。
私は意味を捉えないでいます。

prof_braino
11-01-2010, 11:44 AM
So, did we figure out what he's trying to do?

Hi kyoji, welcone to the prop!

nonnno
11-01-2010, 02:42 PM
Hi

Thank you for all of you.

My words become the funny words without being translated well.
However, I think and write that I am more plain than the Japanese in translation English.

If I searched a project, and there was already it, I wanted to use it.
http://obex.parallax.com/objects/category/5/
I examined the site mentioned above well.
However, I was not able to find it.

Multiple Propellers & one EEPROM
Right way to share memory

What I am aimed for looks almost same as a work of "jazzed".
(I may be not different.)
It is considered that I control "BOEn" by his circuit.
Do you access it in storage cell from plural Propellers without this method stopping each "inside cogs" or Propellers?

I do not yet distinguish parallel or tandem storage cell.
Yours sincerely,
kyoji

jazzed
11-01-2010, 04:07 PM
What I am aimed for looks almost same as a work of "jazzed".
(I may be not different.)
It is considered that I control "BOEn" by his circuit.
Do you access it in storage cell from plural Propellers without this method stopping each "inside cogs" or Propellers?

I do not yet distinguish parallel or tandem storage cell.


kyoji,

I'm not sure what you mean by "storage cell." A stand-alone Propeller needs EEPROM to boot - is this the storage cell you mention?

The BOEn input allows better reset control: if BOEn is low, reset is pulled up internally, else reset is not pulled up (a 1M Ohm pull-down resistor is recommended on the reset pin - I cheated). All Propellers start out as reset and boot one at a time in a serial way (chained). Each reset pin is driven high one at a time in the boot chain.

nonnno
11-02-2010, 04:03 AM
> storage cell = EEPROM&SRAM

> I do not yet distinguish parallel or tandem storage cell.

I can advance without deciding whether I make it which, or I take both.

Hi
Thank you.

I use "Infoseek translation" recently.
This one has little vocabulary, but context is steady than others, but it is in unstable contents when I do not add "I" to the beginning of a sentence.
I have trouble with the choice of words.
I think next to be important.
I connect "the prop" of two or three first of all (P except COG,HUB,BOEn,XI,RESn,P28~P31,).
I aim at the joint ownership of continuous "EEPROM-boot" and later sporadic "storage cell - SRAM".

I read some articles,
I knew を which did "EEPROM to boot" one after another with "BOEn".
In this case what would you do to order an address of "boot" to individual "prop" and "COG"?

If there is it in 1 degree first "boot", you may suffer at little time.
"Read/Write" between aspect each other later wants to make it fast.
In this case Get set! Go! "is a signal of" and can take the mutual synchronization?
In addition, is such a thing synchronizing significant?

At a lot of places that were similar to this, I watched the same topic, but it was written directly and said it figuratively and I could not judge it and have hesitated.

I wonder if I can obtain the information that I find if I do it how
(the English understanding does not advance)

If there is a brief connection diagram, I can do judgment early.
Yours sincerely,
kyoji

jazzed
11-02-2010, 07:50 PM
I aim at the joint ownership of continuous "EEPROM-boot" and later sporadic "storage cell - SRAM".

Joint ownership of continuous "EEPROM-boot" at Propeller boot time is not possible because the Propeller does not check for multi-master arbitration at boot time.



I knew を which did "EEPROM to boot" one after another with "BOEn".
In this case what would you do to order an address of "boot" to individual "prop" and "COG"?

I'm not sure what this means "order an address of boot".
I'll guess that it referes to "boot as needed" and/or "assign an ID address" for each device.

Boot as needed can be controlled by a master Propeller with separate reset lines for each chip. Either serial port programmed boot can be used with common serial port connection or EEPROM boot can be used. Serial port programming will be shorter and would allow automatically assigning an address by modifying the Propeller ID address in the program before download (this eleminates serial port communication for ID assignment).

EEPROM boot loading as I have done with OctoProp requires another method for ID assignment. An alternative to serial port ID address assignment is to use Propeller pins connected as an ID address, but that is a waste of pins.

Individual COG inside a Propeller are managed by each Propeller program. It can be arranged for each COG to have an address if necessary for inter-Propeller communication points such as "Propeller.COG" number within a byte with 5 bits for Propeller ID and 3 bits for COG ID.



If there is it in 1 degree first "boot", you may suffer at little time.

Unfortunately, Propeller booting from EEPROM takes about 1 second for any configuration. Propeller booting from serial port pins 30 and 31 is faster for small programs. EEPROM boot reads all 32KB into Propeller HUB SRAM where serial port boot only loads what is necessary to work.



"Read/Write" between aspect each other later wants to make it fast.
In this case Get set! Go! "is a signal of" and can take the mutual synchronization?

In addition, is such a thing synchronizing significant?


Maybe you are referring to "arbitration" ... for multi-master arbitration is critical. For single master it is less important, but there still needs to be a protocol to initiate read/write transactions.



At a lot of places that were similar to this, I watched the same topic, but it was written directly and said it figuratively and I could not judge it and have hesitated.

I wonder if I can obtain the information that I find if I do it how
(the English understanding does not advance)

If there is a brief connection diagram, I can do judgment early.

One can consider a "top-down" approach where the features required are defined in vague terms and then the design implementation for the features is developed in detailed concrete terms. The likely hood of success depends on the simplicity of the design. Multi-master parallel bus arbitrated design is least likely to succeed unless a standard such as PCI is used (or a sub-set).

There are other approaches to a multiple-Propeller design that you might consider. 1) Multi-Master-Mesh would have all Propellers connected via serial ports like spokes in a wheel. 2) Multi-Master-Ring would allow two point-to-point connections via serial ports per device and information is passed to all "stations" similar to SONET or Token-Ring. As far as data rates, the Parallel approach with single master can have 5MB/s transfers. Multi-Master-Ring is limited by serial port speed which can be up to 14Mbit/s. Multi-Master-Mesh can have aggregate transfer rates of more than 14Mbit/s simultaneously depending on the number of connections.

Hope this helps some way.
--Steve

nonnno
11-03-2010, 10:57 AM
Hi
jazzed - Steve
Thank You

I rely on the translation.
It becomes impossible to understand the content from the translation and.

It introduces freetool that makes the schematic diagram though whether it needs it for you is not understood.
Please use it if it is good.
http://www.suigyodo.com/online/schsoft.htm

I failed hearing it from one degree too much a lot.
I make the circuit that first unites three prop.
P-28, 29, 30, and 31 are made a special usage.
It hesitates whether to make to the triangle at this time or to make it to Y character type.

jazzed
11-05-2010, 03:02 PM
I'm sorry. I do not know how much I can help.
Maybe this thread will be easier to follow:
http://forums.parallax.com/showthread.php?t=124343