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marcal
04-06-2009, 11:51 PM
Anybody think the propeller is OK for starters to programing micros? are PIC etc very more easy to learn? Is there a good starting book. I do not even find how to store a text string as a variable after looking for 1 day!

Kye
04-07-2009, 12:03 AM
Uh, yes the propeller is a good starting place if you have the will to learn. I suggest buying the hydra kit and going in from there. Its the best book in the market.

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Nyamekye,

Oldbitcollector (Jeff)
04-07-2009, 12:11 AM
Here are some starter tutorials
www.warrantyvoid.us/tiki-index.php?page=Tutorial (http://www.warrantyvoid.us/tiki-index.php?page=Tutorial)

BTW, If you don't see what you are looking for, ASK. :)




CON
_clkmode = xtal1 + pll16x
_XinFREQ = 5_000_000

OBJ
text : "tv_text"

PUB MAIN | A
text.start(12)

A:=string("This is a line of text")
text.str(A)




OBC

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New to the Propeller?

Visit the: The Propeller Pages (http://www.warrantyvoid.us/tiki-index.php?page=Propeller) @ Warranty Void.

Post Edited (Oldbitcollector) : 4/6/2009 5:23:24 PM GMT

KPR
04-07-2009, 12:30 AM
Is the Hydra book in electornic/pdf format or is it only bound?

k.

Mike Green
04-07-2009, 12:35 AM
I believe that it is only sold as a bound volume / CD combination. The CD does have a PDF version of the book as well as lots of programs.

It's worth every penny of the $50.

FearTurtles
04-07-2009, 12:37 AM
Honestly the easiest place to start is with the Basic Stamp(BS). There is a lot of material available free that will talk you through just about everything. The Basic programing language that it uses is as much straight forward as you can get IMO. However in the end if you really plain on building something that is more demanding then what the Stamp can handle then you will be better off stepping up to the challenge of the Propeller. It offers a lot more features but the programming is more complex. There is enough material to get you started in programming with the Propeller but it is not nearly as complete as for the BS. The first propeller board that I got was the Demo board. With it you can write programs for it with out the need for creating electronic devices for it to control. Simple add a mouse, keyboard, and monitor and you have basically a minicomputer to program. The downside to it is that it only leave 8 I/0's available for when you do add to it.

KPR
04-07-2009, 12:37 AM
Actually here's another question, the hydra has a 10 mhz clock instead if the 5 mhz, does that mean that the propeller is running twice as fast and if thats the case, do you get better performance using a 10 mhz crystal.. if not why is it different?

Leon
04-07-2009, 12:54 AM
Both actually run at 80 MHz when using the PLL: the Hydra uses an 8x PLL multiplier with a 10 MHz crystal and most other Propeller systems use a 16x multiplier with a 5 MHz crystal. 10 MHz crystals tend to be easier to obtain in small packages.

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Amateur radio callsign: G1HSM
Suzuki SV1000S motorcycle

Oldbitcollector (Jeff)
04-07-2009, 12:54 AM
Not really..

The Protoboard runs @ 80mhz (5mhz crystal) using the following settings.

_clkmode = xtal1 + pll16x
_XinFREQ = 5_000_000

The Hydra runs @ 80mhz (10mhz crystal) using the following settings.

_clkmode = xtal1 + pll8x
_XinFREQ = 10_000_000

Both run at 80mhz.

OBC

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New to the Propeller?

Visit the: The Propeller Pages (http://www.warrantyvoid.us/tiki-index.php?page=Propeller) @ Warranty Void.

parts-man73
04-07-2009, 12:55 AM
There is an internal clock multiplier in the Propeller - it can set to various multipliers (powers of 2 up to 16x)

With a 5 mhz crystal, the PLL multiplier is set to x16 - giving you a 80mhz effective clock speed

with the 10 mhz crystal, the PLL is set to x8 - same 80 mhz effective clock

and before you ask - no you can't use the 10mhz crystal with a 16x multiplier, there has been some success at overclocking, but 160 mhz is outside the limits of the current Propeller.

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Brian

uController.com (http://uController.com) - home of SpinStudio - the modular Development system for the Propeller

PropNIC (http://uController.com) - Add ethernet ability to your Propeller! PropJoy (http://uController.com) - Plug in a joystick and play some games!

SD card Adapter (http://uController.com) - mass storage for the masses Audio/Video adapter (http://uController.com) add composite video and sound to your Proto Board

Oldbitcollector (Jeff)
04-07-2009, 12:57 AM
Mike Green said...
I believe that it is only sold as a bound volume / CD combination. The CD does have a PDF version of the book as well as lots of programs.

It's worth every penny of the $50.



Correction, The Hydra CD contains a copy of another great book on creating games (pdf),
but the Hydra book itself is only released as a bound volume.

Mike is right about the Hydra book being worth purchase.

OBC

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New to the Propeller?

Visit the: The Propeller Pages (http://www.warrantyvoid.us/tiki-index.php?page=Propeller) @ Warranty Void.

KPR
04-07-2009, 01:11 AM
Thanks guys.. I'm still finish up wiring my protoboard now that I got all of my stuff from Brian.. just not enough time in the day.. I wish I had the skill set ( and money ) to make my own prop board I'd make it the size of a YBOX2 but add more expansion headers.. oh we'll maybe in the future..

SRLM
04-07-2009, 01:11 AM
There is also the Propeller Education labs with a bound book. I don't have the book, but I've read through the labs and they're pretty good. It's more of a general introduction, rather than game specific (although the hydra does have some general propeller).

mikediv
04-07-2009, 01:31 AM
marcal (http://forums.parallax.com/member.php?u=55921)·just my .02 cents but I first bought the Hydra system Mike is right·worth ·every penny but to be honest for me anyway I went back and bought the propstick or the prop proto board and started doing all the online stuff and to be honest I have learned so much more becuase most fo the guys here have the same stuff proto board or propstick I was able to use all there examples and understand most of it. Now don't get me wrong I know you can do most of the same with the Hydra and I love mine but I can now do more stuff with my Hydra becuase I learned with the prop educational kit. If you are like me and are starting from scratch I would get the educational kit but at some point I would also get a Hydra the book that comes with the Hydra is worth the cost alone. Oh also if you want to do a lot of hardware stuff as well the propstick comes with a nice big solderless bread board for building all the example circuits. But when comparing do not forget the fact that the Hydra is the best way in my opinion to learn how to do Games and graphics it even comes with a joystick I think Parallax should offer a bundled version of the Hydra with a propstick or proto board /educational kit combination.
I would have just bought that and saved some time. ·

marcal
04-07-2009, 01:40 AM
thank you all (OBC for code :)) very good persons here:) I have demo board and won't buy the hydra,

Maybe I will try to learn not so fast! now I stop for rest and food.

briankb
04-07-2009, 03:39 AM
I want to get started with the Propeller as well. But I'm a bit confused about what hardware to purchase.

In the store there is a Hydra Developer Kits $199, the Book/CD/Propeller chip for $49.99, and just the book and cd for $49.99.

Before seeing this post today I was considering getting the Propeller Development Board and reading whatever PDF's are available. I would like to get to know the Propeller a little better and it seems that game development book is a good start, as suggested. Can I get through the book using the PPDB and the Book/CD/Chip combo? Or do I need the HYDRA system along with the book? I don't have a lot of interest in gaming with it but knowing I would like to know how the graphics and the chip works in general.

Oldbitcollector (Jeff)
04-07-2009, 03:50 AM
briankb said...
I want to get started with the Propeller as well. But I'm a bit confused about what hardware to purchase.



Recently someone asked it "It was worth it?" referring to the Hydra Kit.
Some good answers were given here: http://forums.parallax.com/showthread.php?p=795587

As far as the book and chip are concerned. Both are the same price. If you are
buying the book by itself, take the free chip. :)

OBC

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New to the Propeller?

Visit the: The Propeller Pages (http://www.warrantyvoid.us/tiki-index.php?page=Propeller) @ Warranty Void.

SciNemo
04-07-2009, 04:17 AM
I got the Propeller Demo Board recently. Was my first experience with the Propeller. It was very easy to use, even more so than the legendary Arduino, which I've used extensively before. I was up and running in 10 minutes without reading a single sentence of the manual.

If you are a total beginner with micros, or micros and programming, you might want to look elsewhere, but you run the risk of not getting something that can be expanded on. The Prop is easy to use, and has the horsepower you will want for future projects.

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No reference to the fish.
http://sites.google.com/site/bitwinproject/

briankb
04-07-2009, 04:38 AM
Thanks for the initial replies. I am a windows/web developer and have experience with the BS2.

Cluso99
04-07-2009, 05:19 AM
Personally, I would go for the cheap entry to learn. Once you know what it can do you can always make better judgements on what you want later.

So, I would go for the Propeller Proto Board (USB version) and also buy the connector kit if you can afford it (it comes with a special keyboard/mouse/VGA connector). If you just want to use composite video (TV) you can make your own simply on the prototype area on the board. You will also want a LED (get a superbright one and a 4.7K resistor or a normal one and a 1K resistor).

There are execellent tutorials. The propeller manual (pdf) has a whole chapter(s) to start. Then have a look at OBC's Cookbook and his starter tutorials. And also have a look at the wiki - there are some excellent tutorials there also. Before you solder too much onto your board, look at OBC's cookbook so you leave the required space to add Spin Studio conectors in case you want to add some of those boards later.

And lastly, if you don't understand something, ask here on the forum. As you can see you had three answers simultaneously about your crystal question. This is a fantastic place for advice and discussions. You will not be sorry if you go the Propeller Chip route.

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Links to other interesting threads:

· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBladeProp (http://forums.parallax.com/showthread.php?p=786418), SixBladeProp (http://forums.parallax.com/showthread.php?p=780033), website (Multiple propeller pcbs) (http://bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm)
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator) (http://forums.parallax.com/showthread.php?p=790917)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index) (http://forums.parallax.com/showthread.php?p=753439)
· Emulators: Micros eg Altair, and Terminals eg VT100 (Index (http://forums.parallax.com/showthread.php?p=778427))
· Search the Propeller forums (via Google) (http://search.parallax.com/search?site=parallax&client=parallax&output=xml_no_dtd&proxystylesheet=parallax&proxycustom=<HOME/>&ie=&oe=&lr=)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz (http://www.bluemagic.biz)·· MultiBladeProp is: www.bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm (http://www.bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm)

SRLM
04-07-2009, 05:28 AM
Personally, I really like the Propeller Professional Development Board. I'm nowhere near professional, but it's a well designed board with everything that you'll probably use, and plenty of breadboard space. A bit spendy, but it does come up periodically as a daily deal.

briankb
04-07-2009, 05:47 AM
@Cluso99 - thanks for the info. Before I buy I'm going to read more of the tutorials and manual so, as you said, I'll be making a better decision for my particular needs.

@SRLM - that's what I was thinking as well. it has all the little bits and pieces I would have to wire up if I just get a demo or proto board. I've been keeping an eagle eye on the daily deals this past week. They have almost 500 in stock so I could see it going on sale soon (request, please pretty please, begging...) http://forums.parallax.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

SRLM did you also get the Hydra manual and cd? It sounds like a very detailed and good book but I would hate to get it and be out of luck because I don't have the HYDRA system.

It's mostly a hobby for me. I love programming and moving from my daily gig of .NET win/web development to these controllers is just fun and a great distraction. And the bonus is I get a lot of related education on programming.

Thanks again for everyone's input and marcal for letting me somewhat hijack this thread. Hopefully in a good way.

jazzed
04-07-2009, 05:58 AM
The Hydra book and CD are very good and worth $50.
Ray's bookmarked version of PropellerManual.pdf is very valuable as a reference.
http://rayslogic.com/propeller/Propeller%20Manual%20v1.01bmarked.pdf

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--Steve


Propalyzer: Propeller PC Logic Analyzer (http://www.brouhaha.com/~sdenson/Propalyzer)
http://forums.parallax.com/showthread.php?p=788230 (http://forums.parallax.com/showthread.php?p=788230)

SRLM
04-07-2009, 06:03 AM
I got the hydra kit mostly for the book. It's a complete introduction to the Propeller and various hardware aspects in the first half of the book, and the second half or so is more about games. It's certainly a more newbie friendly book than something like the propeller manual. I haven't looked at the CD yet, though.