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Brian_B
01-12-2008, 11:15 AM
Chip,
·Would it be possible for you to program a RadHard FPGA to be a propeller for our lunar rover ?

www.propelX.com (http://www.propelX.com)


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Thank's Brian



·"Imagination is more important than knowledge..." ·· Albert Einstein

http://www.diycalculator.com/subroutines.shtml· My favorite website

cgracey
01-12-2008, 11:56 AM
Brian Beckius said...
Chip,
·Would it be possible for you to program a RadHard FPGA to be a propeller for our lunar rover ?

www.propelX.com (http://www.propelX.com)


It's likely possible, but it would take too much time away from the ongoing next-Propeller effort. An FPGA implementation would be a relative power hog, I think. Is it not possible to adequately shield the current chip?

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Chip Gracey
Parallax, Inc.

Brian_B
01-12-2008, 12:06 PM
Chip,
For $500,000 for 3 rad hard FPGA's we are trying all we can to get the propeller there.This is a ways off , but would you help with radiation testing?

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Thank's Brian



·"Imagination is more important than knowledge..." ·· Albert Einstein

http://www.diycalculator.com/subroutines.shtml· My favorite website


Post Edited (Brian Beckius) : 1/12/2008 5:18:25 AM GMT

cgracey
01-13-2008, 05:54 AM
Brian Beckius said...
Chip,
For $500,000 for 3 rad hard FPGA's we are trying all we can to get the propeller there.This is a ways off , but would you help with radiation testing?


Brian,

I suppose you are worried about soft errors or latch-up due to Beta, Gamma, and X radiation? I know that Alpha radiation coming from isotopes in solder balls have been known to cause soft errors in flip chips, but since all the Propellers are packaged in plastic, that shouldn't be a problem. So, Beta and up are of concern. The Propeller design was not done with radiation hardness in mind, so, like you,·I don't think it would fare especially well in a high-radiation environment.

Here, Boeing talks about ASIC libraries they've developed which·afford some·rad-hardness using commercial IC processes:

http://www.boeing.com/defense-space/infoelect/elecdev/radhard.html

They also list some equipment they have which is used to test for radiation hardness. I can tell you that Parallax doesn't have those types of machines, but they advertise lab test services using them.

We'll certainly cooperate with any needed info, samples, etc. I don't know what else we could do, for now. On that Boeing page, they mention that there are rad-hard dedicated foundries. Sounds like a lot of commitment for what is probably just a few wafers, here and there. That must be why you got that $500k price.


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Chip Gracey
Parallax, Inc.

Brian_B
01-13-2008, 10:26 AM
Chip,
It’s hard to get any info from anybody in the RadHard field; they just want to sell stuff. The latch-up deal seems to more a memory issue than a processor issue. If that is true we could use RadHard memory and then fire the propeller up after we get through the Van Allen radiation belt (with a little shielding).

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Thank's Brian



·"Imagination is more important than knowledge..." ·· Albert Einstein

http://www.diycalculator.com/subroutines.shtml· My favorite website

Brian_B
01-28-2008, 07:20 AM
Chip,
I'm working on installing the propeller on a Actel rad hard fpga, so far I think I have 2 cogs running at the same time , but have not even tried to work on the hub yet . I'll keep you posted.

Brian

edit- I guess I only have one cog up and running , and at very limited capacity , back to the drawing board.

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Thank's Brian



·"Imagination is more important than knowledge..." ·· Albert Einstein

http://www.diycalculator.com/subroutines.shtml· My favorite website


Post Edited (Brian Beckius) : 1/28/2008 2:10:27 AM GMT

Lawson
01-29-2008, 09:03 AM
This is sounding like testing is needed. Setting up a demo on a proto-board and cooking it in high energy radiation for a while shouldn't be too costly. It's no uncommon for major Universities to have radiation sources and even experimental nuclear reactors. The University might even have a professor or two that study radiation effects on semiconductors.

The other tid-bit I've heard is that light elements make better shielding for high-energy radiation. Stick the electronics in the center of the fuel tank?

my 0.000002 cents
Marty

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Lunch cures all problems! have you had lunch?

Brian_B
01-29-2008, 09:21 AM
marty,
cool ,never thought of the fuel tank deal. http://forums.parallax.com/images/smilies/smile.gif

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Thank's Brian



·"Imagination is more important than knowledge..." ·· Albert Einstein

http://www.diycalculator.com/subroutines.shtml· My favorite website